Fringe Episode 3.02 The Box


FRINGE 3.02 THE BOX

WALTER COPES WITH CONSEQUENCES OF HIS CHOICES ON AN ALL-NEW “FRINGE” THURSDAY, SEPTEMBER 30, ON FOX

The story alternates to the Fringe Team ‘over here’ where they investigate a mystifying case that people are discovered in a trance-like state that ultimately leads to their death. The unlikely suspect: a mysterious box. As Peter and Walter collaborate to study its properties, alternate Olivia presses on and turns up the heat on an unsuspecting Peter. Meanwhile, key information about the future is revealed when Walter and Nina meet at Massive Dynamic for the reading of the last will and testament of William Bell.

Cast: Anna Torv as Olivia Dunham; Joshua Jackson as Peter Bishop; John Noble as Walter Bishop; Lance Reddick as Phillip Broyles; Blair Brown as Nina Sharp; Jasika Nicole as Astrid Farnsworth

Guest Cast: Sebastian Roché as Thomas Jerome Newton; Russell Harvard as Joe; Artine Brown as Mitch; Kyle Cassie as Darryl; Hiro Kanagawa as Executor; Eric Lynch as Homeless Man

3.02 “The Box” Sneak Peek

3.02 "The Box" Episode Rating

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Comments

  1. says

    There seems to be a funny vibe between Astrid and Altlivia. I wonder if Our Lady of the Misspoken Name is ahead of everyone else in sensing something amiss.

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  2. LMH says

    I don’t get scared or jump at things, but this episode made me jump a couple times. That alone is a feat.
    The key! Really looked like the key from the Pilot, I thought that’s where they were going with it.
    Loved that they had the lead scientist of the Dharma Initiative!
    Walter made me tear up when he tried to speak his heart to Peter. John Noble once again.

    Very tense episode, I enjoyed it. With Walter’s new situation, scary yes, but perhaps Fringe Division over here will get a little extra funding, bringing it somewhat more on par with the AltFD. Fringe and MD will surely come closer and more intertwined as entities, what will be the result? What might Nina (and perhaps even Bell ‘from the grave’) have up their sleeve? Saw it coming, but now that it’s done it does give pause.

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  3. bdp says

    I thought it was a great episode. It’s great to see Peter getting so involved in the goings on on this side and I love getting the glimpses of the real Altlivia: her dedication to her job and yet her clear remorse at being ordered to kill the deaf guy, also just the little personality differences between her and Olivia. I’m not going to lie, my loyalty will always lie with our Olivia obviously, I mean how can you not love her but hell I’m starting to really love Altlivia too. She’s a lot of fun and there’s moments where you can clearly see she’s not as bad as a lot of people think she is. And I think I have to agree with Josh Jackson in the respect that I can definitely see the animalistic attraction between Peter and Altliv (did anyone else catch the hint of jealousy in the bar scene when Peter was talking about Altlivia’s red hair) but in the end, yeah, Peter and Olivia are much more connected. I look forward to seeing their relationship continue to grow. I read an interview with Anna Torv today where she spoke about how their relationship starts with Altlivia simply being all about her mission but over time Peter starts to grow on her and I think that’s going to be exactly what happens.

    Very intrigued as to what, the work on Dr. Bishop message is supposed to mean, work on him how? Great set up there.

    My theory for the big picture of the weapon and the universes at war stories going on right now is this: I think Walternate was not entirely untruthful in his “Over There” comment to Peter when he said Peter could fix the problems of their world. But however, my theory is that Peter won’t have to go the route of destroying our universe to fix the other one and I don’t think he would be able to destroy either of them as evidenced by his talk with Altlivia in this episode. I think Peter’s search into the weapon will eventually lead him to discover a way to fix the other side while staying in ours at the same time (that is even where he feels he belongs by the way). Whether that will happen this season I strongly doubt it, it’s way too early but I think it will eventually happen that way.

    This season just continues to shape up to be a momentous one. Waiting til Thursdays is just such torture.

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      • bdp says

        haha I really wish I could. If the show ever comes across that universe, I know I’m devoting my free time to finding it.

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    • ApplesBananasRhinoceros says

      The wait for Thursdays really is pure torture… I kinda wish they would move it to Tuesdays just so for one week we get an episode on Thursday and then another one only 5 days later instead of 7…

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    • Rae says

      Really? I was betting on either Walter getting all of it or splitting it with Nina. I would have been pretty P.O.’d at Bell otherwise!

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  4. Anita says

    Do you think Bell had a plan in terms of bequeathing MD to Walter at this point? Obviously Bell knew more than Walter does and I think there might be a really important reason for having Walter inherit it right for this time.

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  5. Peter says

    This season is off to a great start. Who knew Newton was a U2 fan?
    “We’re one, but we’re not the same.”

    Also, as soon as Walter started looking at that bloody tie, I knew what was coming.

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  6. 7063keisha says

    wow i really dont like to cuss but this episode was so intense that it made me cuss (on accident) so i definitly think this was the best episode EVER!!!!!

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  7. aci79 says

    I love this episode overall. However, I am bother by Peter not noticing or asking Alt-Olivia about not drinking. Olivia always drink.

    When they mentioned about having a reading of Bell’s will, I immediately thought of who would inherit MD. I am kind of excited about the future of Walter and MD. He may be unstable in a lot of ways, but he is still genius with no desire for “power”. Now that they both have access to remarkable resources, it should be a great foundation to a Walter vs. Walternate.

    The Alt-Olivia jumping into the train track to save Peter was an awesome moment. Was it genuine or just a part of her mission? I liked her for a moment :-) In this episode I can’t really hate Alt-Olivia, she’s just a soldier following orders. But I still can’t help it to label her an enemy at this time. She is pretending on purpose after all, unlike Olivia who is trapped and drugged in the other side.

    I really love Walter and Astrid moments in this episode. She is there for him as usual.

    It was priceless to see the scene when Alt-Olivia was dragging the dead body and Peter was at the door. It was like “Are you kidding me? Stopping by while I am dragging a dead body. Can it be any better timing than that?”

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    • bdp says

      Hahaha yea I agree with your Altlivia stuff. As for the part with Altlivia jumping into the train tracks to save Peter, obviously a large part of it was that she NEEDS Peter to complete her mission so she can’t afford for any harm to come to him no matter what but I also feel that after spending a few days with Peter she does care for him enough that she doesn’t want him to be hurt. Like I said before, I really don’t think she’s a bad person at all, as much as I want to view them as the enemies, she genuinely seems kind hearted but just thrown into a horrible situation in order to save the entire existence of the world that she lives in. I think as the season goes she’ll continue to grow with Peter and become even harder to dislike while she also becomes more accepting to the view of our side (possibly eventually realizing, like the writers want US to do, that there really isn’t a Righr or a Wrong side in this whole situation).

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      • Ann_Louise says

        I think that with the exceptions of Walternate and Altlivia and Weasel Brandonate, everyone else Over There has been shown as a decent human being. Except for those three (and maybe the creepy shrink), I really like everyone else.

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  8. mlj102 says

    It was a good episode… and I’m likely in the minority, but I just didn’t think it was anything spectacular.

    The plot itself — everything surrounding the box — was certainly intriguing, and it holds a lot of promise, but I felt like it fell short a bit. It could be that I would benefit from a rewatch, but I just didn’t feel incredibly invested in the story. The climax in particular felt lacking. I didn’t feel the tension or any particular emotion surrounding the events taking place. It felt a bit contrived and a bit forced, in my opinion. It was still good… just not great.

    Walter and Peter… that development is a bit strange to me. On the one hand, it’s very much how I expected it would be given what has taken place between them. There’s a certain tension there and neither one is completely comfortable with the other. It’s particularly apparent in the way Walter is turning more towards Astrid in his dilemmas, and Peter is turning more towards (alternate) Olivia. And yet there are also moments when they are acting as though all is normal and they are fine and happy, getting along as if nothing had happened. And that is just not practical. It seems as if things are too natural and comfortable between them, considering everything they’ve been through. I can’t believe that Peter would even still be living in the same house as Walter at this point…

    Alternate Olivia was particularly irritating to me. She was nothing like our Olivia… nothing at all. And I suppose that’s part of what bothered me. While I wouldn’t expect her to be a perfect imitation of our Olivia, I would expect something a bit more convincing. And I couldn’t help comparing her actions to how our Olivia would be responding to that particular situation. Like when Peter came to see her after Walter had confronted him. Her comments and her actions were nothing like how Olivia would have acted. Which leads me to my biggest complaint: How in the world is it that Peter and the others haven’t realized it’s not their Olivia? I know all the excuses: she’s in love, going to the other side caused her to rethink her life and to implement certain changes, Peter’s in love, he’s in denial, he’s got other things on his mind, etc. But those things can only go so far, in my opinion. And it completely cheapens the relationships that have been established between our Olivia and the other characters if they are completely oblivious to the fact that it’s not the same Olivia. I don’t understand how Peter could pick up on those differences, yet dismiss them so easily. People have asked if we weren’t aware of the switch, would we be able to pick up on the fact that it wasn’t our Olivia? In my opinion, absolutely.

    I just don’t like where they’re going with alternate Olivia at this point. I want to like her… I really do. But I don’t. Someone else mentioned how they’re really starting to like alternate Olivia, which surprised me because I’m the exact opposite. I want to like her, but this episode didn’t give me any reason to like her. I didn’t feel the conflict in her when she had to kill the deaf man. For all the people who have accused our Olivia of being cold-hearted, she’s got nothing in comparison to alternate Olivia. I found her to be too lighthearted and superficial, too cocky and arrogant, too manipulative and evil. I want to like her, but based on this episode, I can’t.

    Of course, all that isn’t to say that this episode didn’t have its redemptive qualities. There were definitely good parts to it. I loved the humor… there were some great moments that made me absolutely laugh. There were also some really intriguing comments (all the ones about reality and such particularly stood out to me). I even quite enjoyed the scene where Peter and alternate Olivia were dancing (I was thrilled with the song choice!). I also really like the potential of what they’re building up to, what with the weapon, alternate Olivia’s mission, Walter inheriting Massive Dynamic, etc. It was a good episode… I’m just not thrilled with it.

    That said, next week, on the other hand, looks like another very promising episode and I’m excited to see what they have in store for us.

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    • bdp says

      I’m not sure if I was the one being referred to in that I said I was starting to like Altlivia but I know I did say that and as far as my reasoning for it I do agree with you in the sense that I definitely did not like her killing the deaf guy. I mean I saw regret in her killing him but it was close enough that I could understand people not seeing it too, it’s just how I took it. As for the liking of Altlivia, it wasn’t scenes like that but rather the bar scenes and things from last season’s finale that have made me like her. She’s just a more fun version Olivia than the one we have (don’t get me wrong I still love our Olivia more) she’s just likable to me, when she isn’t in complete soldier mode. I also think a big part of it for me is that I see a shift in Altlivia coming where she becomes less hardened and militaristic against this side and at least somewhat understanding.

      Also I think that some of her responses were actually very on point with what our Olivia would have said, while I do agree that some were way off base. But the comments like “Walter never could have known how much damage would have been done” and “I understand Walter’s worries about the weapon but we really need him to understand what it does” I can absolutely see Olivia saying to Peter in those situations. Just my opinion though obviously. I mean this is probably the first time I’ve disagreed with you on stuff haha.

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    • FinChase says

      MLJ, you’re not in the minority here. I also thought it was a good but not special episode. I suppose that it was inevitable that after last week’s emotional powerhouse there would be a bit of a letdown with this episode. I was glad to get a clue about what AltLivia’s mission is, and it confirmed my expectations that she and Newton will have an uneasy and possibly even antagonistic working relationship.

      The development about Walter inheriting all of MD was somewhat surprising to me, not least because I was under the impression from earlier episodes that MD was a publicly traded company. How could Bell have been the sole share holder? We’ll see how that plays out. At least it should give the writers more excuses to let us see Nina Sharp more often.

      Regarding the murder, color me disappointed with this direction the story has taken. Yes, I did see signs of remorse in AltLivia; she didn’t want to kill him and it was partly to prove to Newton that she is hard and tough enough to be in charge of this mission. But her character has an uphill battle now to recover. I admit that I wanted/want to like AltLivia and to see her viewpoint in all this, but they aren’t making this easier. I don’t really have a problem that she seems excited and lighthearted at times in the beginning; in many ways all this must have seemed like just a big adventure to her. Hopefully, it has now become a lot more dark and real to her. I did think that the moment when she jumped into the tunnel and ran to save Peter reminded me of Olivia. Perhaps she was just reacting to save her mission, but I think this may be a similarity between the two in that they are both willing to risk their own lives to save someone else.

      I have to admit that the moment that moved me the most in the episode was the little video clip of our Olivia. It just underscored for me how much I miss her. Since AltLivia confirmed that she does not have a photographic memory, I assume that we are to attribute this to Cortexiphan, although I suppose it could be a natural difference between the two.

      I’m looking forward to next week’s episode. It looks very interesting, and we have still to find out more about Walternate’s plans.

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      • aci79 says

        I agree with you completely, FinChase, about the little video clip of Olivia on the computer. I do miss her a lot. She’s genuine and I love how she crack a little smile in the middle of her seriousness :-)
        But again, we’ve just started to see the Alt-Olivia, so I will give it more time for her character to grow into something more than just “Doing Undercover Work”.

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      • jophan says

        “The development about Walter inheriting all of MD was somewhat surprising to me, not least because I was under the impression from earlier episodes that MD was a publicly traded company.”
        This is a pretty pure fanwank, but a number of companies, such as Google and Comcast, have two classes of stock: with and without voting rights. If Walter holds all the voting stock, he basically owns the company because every executive and member of the board must be approved by him. The non-voting stockholders just get dividends or gains when they sell.

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    • FlashWriter says

      I completely agree, MLH. Since the show runners were pushing the “there’s no good-bad between universes” line, I found Bolivia’s cold-hearted execution of that guy almost nausiating. Like you, I WANT to like her, but who can like someone who’s a stone killer? (Especially since I couldn’t see the reason why she absolutely HAD to kill him.) I find her cockiness annoying. About the only thing I currently am happy about is Anna Torv’s great job doing the character. I can hardly wait until next week to see what she does with her character now that their differences are even more subtle. If anybody can pull it off, she can.

      A good ep, not great. Watchable. (Pretty sad for me to say that, but it’s what I feel.)

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      • WaySeeker says

        “Too bad he’s not blind.” That is your answer as to why she had to kill the deaf man. It was great to see her hesitate and apologize as she did it. She is a soldier, and she still is under the idea that Walternate says we are “creatures who have ripped the very fabric of reality.” It was a good character development scene. Remember, Over There Walternate oversees Fringe Division and he is Secretary of Defense. That would carry a LOT of weight, especially when they see the results of their world falling apart. But it is even better that nothing is black-or-white in this show, it is very smart and daring!

        I like when Bolivia is watching the video of Olivia and reads that she has photographic memory and quips “How am I going to do THAT!” Heehee, didn’t quite know what you were getting yourself into, did you? I like the THEME here. Bolivia is a soldier that is following orders to come Over Here and pretend to be Olivia. While Olivia volunteered to go Over There to save Peter and now she against her will she has Bolivia’s memories inside her. (perhaps voluntarily she realized or will that she is stuck Over There and must “play along” until she can find a way to get back Home, better to be out in the open and free than trapped in that place, we saw how much she HATES being confined! I wonder if her abusive step-father did things like this to her, locked her in a dark small room. I would like to see a flash back to a scene like that … hang on I am making this a separate post!)
        So it plays with reality, perception, sense of self, following orders -vs- voluntary actions, and all kinds of high-end philosophical themes!

        I loved the “Tell-Tale Heart” note when we see the blood pouring out from under the door and she admits what she is doing is a “distraction”. That was very Hitchcockian suspense.

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    • Ari says

      I am agreement with the disenting views here, to the point that I feel like this episode did nothing much for me beyond advancing the narrative. I never realized how Olivia centric the show was until they mess with ehr and now I am underwhelmed and quite annoyed. Altlivia is not likeable to me at all. Character-wise I don’t really buy her being this happy and wholesome, regretful poor soldier that rather not be mean but is just too good at what she does. I don’t see where everyone “gets” that.. You see the real her in her interactions with Newton, their friction shows someone who is in for Team Olivia, very ambitious, and out to secure her position of authority. The value she places on her rank recognition, should not come before her mission of “saving their world” in this war that they “didnt start”, buta pparently it does. I think that the inherent character flaws in her is shown, there’s a shallowness about her happy-go-luckyness, a lack of depth, that I am surprised everyone is dismissing. As far as how could they possibly not think something is “off” with her, for starters her irritating pimp-strut walk is very unlike Olivia, very noticeable. Her smileyness, jokeyness, doesnt drink.. Her interactions and approach to everyone where uncharacteristic. Her and Walter had become close, but now she is kind of off to the side with him. We never see Broyles interact so much with anyone without Olivia being a part of the conversation or leading the action. Altlivia hung back a lot in this episode, edgily, without being the leader that Olivia typically would have been. Its so hokey. Her conversations with Peter: LAME “I think so much has happenned to all of us”- not how Olivia talks. And I don’t think she was sorry to kill the deaf guy, what I think she was is nervous because there’s been glitches to the operation and she is still trying to prove that she can just come in and boss Newton around, she was nervous about prooving she could “handle” it.
      I did like Newton here. I loved that walter called Astrid “Aspirin”. I liked Walter and Astrid. I thought Nina played vulnerable well. My regret in this episode is that it wasn’t ALtlivia’s head that blew up, and she didnt get run over by the train. boo-hoo. I almost hated this episode, I cringed through most of it, and I am hoping that with being back “Overthere” next week it wont suck as much.

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      • Ann_Louise says

        Ari, I agree with many of your points – Altlivia’s shallowness, her ruthlessness, etc. What I found intriguing for future episodes is her conflict with Newton – she’s so the eager little soldier, pulling rank and determined to kiss up to her Boss on the other side. She’s turning into a person I love to hate, much like the late lamented Mr. Jones.

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        • Ari says

          yeah, Alt-livia is developing into someone I’d much rather watch tearing it up at the club on ladie’s night with R@chel than as a super-impostor at Fringe Division..

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  9. HLM says

    I definitely don’t like this Olivia and I, too, wonder how on earth they aren’t wondering what’s wrong with her. I personally will be glad when they’re switched back. We’ve been anticipating a relationship between Peter and Olivia since the beginning of the show and when it finally begins to happen, it’s totally screwed up with this storyline.

    When they do finally figure out what’s going, Peter will have trust issues with Olivia right along with trying to rebuild his relationship with Walter. As I said before, I’ll be glad when this is over and they can get back to where they were.

    I LOVE WALTER! He’s so awesome. I knew as soon as they were reading the will that he was getting Massive Dynamic. That’s probably the only part of the last 2 episodes I’ve liked. Sorry for complaining but I love this show but hate where they’re taking it.

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    • WaySeeker says

      I am begrudgingly following the romance. I don’t like watching romance even tho I can be romantic. Besides they never seem to work on TV. They are so stylized, nobody kisses like that for one thing! I find it very uncomfortable to watch, like I’m spying on people *shudders* Romances between leads, especially when they work together, is also a pain to watch.
      Talk about contrived!
      So, I for one am glad to see it interrupted/complicated just as it was starting. That adds more drama, character development/intrigue, and it is makes for smarter braver story telling. I like watching Bolivia squirm. She has a good man she loves back Over There, and has to — as part of her job — be intimate with Peter instead. It is further awkward because doesn’t she know this is the son of her BOSS boss? Walternate is not only the Secretary of Defense, he also oversees Bolivia’s FD. Now she has to mack on HIS SON of all people, and Peter is equivalent to Helen of Troy so this just isn’t “some guy”.
      It would be far easier for her to do her job if she didn’t have to get romantic with Peter, and so that is why I will enjoy cringing at their romance. She needs to be close with him to manipulate/guide him to THEIR plans, so perhaps Walternate feels she can use this to her advantage.
      All of these details is far better than the alternative … if Olivia never got trapped over there and Bolivia never took her place we would instead have a boring run-of-the-mill romance that would be mind-numblingly boring and uncomfortable to watch … IMHO at least :)

      We all have different points of view, I’m am not saying yours is wrong I am not saying mine is right. I am just sharing mine with yours, both remain valid and real. This would be like arguing over favorite ice cream flavors and hating someone because they don’t choose to have vanilla be their favorite too.

      To be honest, I also feel a jolt away from the romance. But, it makes great story-telling. This also makes a real impact to the dialog of the Observers when they saw Olivia with her niece on the roller coaster. “She looks so happy. Too bad things are going to get so difficult for her.”

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  10. Page 48 says

    So, hair colour isn’t the only difference between Olivia and Altlivia. One way to tell them apart is that Altlivia is the one who murders hearing impaired men sitting at ‘her’ dining room table. I don’t ever want to catch our Olivia doing that. Frankly, I didn’t ever want to see Altlivia doing that. If this is indeed a war, then, regardless of how they do things Over There, this makes Altlivia a war criminal. Not the way I hoped this would unfold. No wonder Charlienate thanked Olivia for not shooting him last week. He meant it.

    At least Broyles had tingling spidey senses tonight. He was the only one asking questions. Walter was in full clown mode (rapid-fire food and fart gags, refreshingly absent in last week’s blockbuster season premiere) and therefore had no time to have his suspicions aroused by a way off-kilter ‘Olivia’.

    Peter, on the other hand, should be ashamed of himself. Every word, every action, every mannerism exhibited by Altlivia should have resulted in giant red flags raining down on the playing field. Honestly, a non-drinking ‘Olivia’ pub dancing to Patsy Cline tunes and Peter doesn’t take a step back and ask himself WTF is going on with this woman?

    Altlivia has heard the story about Walter kidnapping Peter and causing unintended devastation Over There. She knows there isn’t any warring going on (not that she isn’t spoiling for one), so I have to anticipate that she comes around at some point, whether it’s because of her relationship with Peter or whatever else might happen in weeks to come. Notwithstanding the permanent (and disappointing) nature of tonight’s cold blooded gangland slaying, I hope there is something left of Altlivia’s character to rehabilitate before this is all said and done. I really wanted Alt-Fringe to eventually be a PART of the solution, not a major obstacle to it.

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    • annon says

      Why are people so surprised with the writers, when it comes to Peter?

      Peter has, and I suspect will always be a character that the writers use as a plot device. His character changes to whatever they want him to be, to further the plot arc. Peter just goes over to the other side without a second thought, check, because they need him over there. Peter just ignores everything he knows about Olivia, check, because they need altOlivia to get invested in Peter and our side (I think that is where the writers are going with this). You get the idea, and there are a few more.

      I think Roco talked abit about this in his “What we would like for season 3″. About how it would be good for Peter to be a more fleshed out character and not one who just changes on a whim when the writers want him too. (I know he talked about it, but not sure where, so correct me if I’m wrong). I guess they didn’t get Roco’s memo and I sooo want this to happen, because they are seriously ruining his character.

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  11. ApplesBananasRhinoceros says

    I’m pretty sure Peter knows something is up. Too many double-takes and slip-ups… I was just rewatching the episode ‘Peter’ and he knew instinctively that that wasn’t his real father even though he was 7 and didn’t know anything about doppelgangers and alternate universes, so he HAS to know that this non-drinking Olivia practically putting her heart on her sleeve and throwing herself at him isn’t the right Olivia.

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    • tatka_sn says

      I don’like that Peter seems clueless, but as a child he would be 1.more attuned to his parents 2. not clouded by preconceptions. Child feels something and than express his feelings. As an adult, Peter runs most of his impressions though his mind(consiousness). If his mind says “that’s impossible” chances are he’d dismiss facts.

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    • Maggie says

      I think Peter knows somthing is up. but since he doesnt know what it is exactly…hes just going along with it/buying her excuse for now. He did look a bit suprized/confused about a number of things she did.

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  12. says

    I’m jumping on the “How could they not….” bandwagon. I realize there is a lot going on and everyone seems to be distracted, but give me a flipping break.

    Had we (the audience) not been privy to the switch last season, tonight would have been the night we would have figured it out. The writers literally go out of there way to show that this Olivia is not quite what she seems. What is with the big set up?

    Like others have said, the most obvious tell was not even attempting to nurse a drink at the bar. I thought, “Peter! Come on man, you’re not even going to comment on her letting you drink alone.” I recall Peter and our Liv throwing them back together pretty frequently. Then again, if he had suspicions who would he tell? He and Walter are not in the best place.

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    • bdp says

      I’m glad someone else has finally raised that final argument of yours. That has been one of my fundamental beliefs in that maybe Peter actually does know something is up with Altlivia/Olivia this whole time. I mean if he does think it’s actually Altlivia pretending to be Olivia, do you really think he’s going to jump right in her face and say “I know you’re not really Olivia”. There’s no way he would do that for the simple fact that what if he were wrong, that would absolutely kill their relationship and at this point the relationship he believes he is having with Olivia is the only the he can hold onto to keep him happy and sane. I mean the guy’s in a pretty rough and crappy place right now.

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  13. number six says

    In general, I liked this episode much better than the last one, mainly, because the strangeness wasn’t over the top and it was understandable. Last week, it felt like I was watching a different show with totally different characters. Even Olivia didn’t feel like our Olivia from the very beginning, which took me out of the show way too often. The Box had better pacing and all the elements that give Fringe its distinctive vibe.

    The only problem I had with this episode: I can’t believe how terrible Altlivia is and I’m not referring to her murder in cold blood of that poor deaf man. So far she’s a very one dimensional character like Walternate, the latter having the advantage of a superior actor playing him, but that’s not my complaint. I can deal with not sympathizing with her or liking her. What I can’t deal with, is her over the top smirking and too obvious contempt. So far, she hasn’t done anything too telling, but I hope she tones down her attitude and her make-up a bit, because I didn’t find her convincing at all. The only good thing she did was saving Peter in that kickass way, but right now I’m rooting for Newton to kill her as soon as possible. Newton seems to like her as much as I do and I love him for that.

    So how didn’t they notice? Because no one was looking at her. Surely Peter was with her more often than the others, but there was a strange quality to their interactions. It’s like they subconsciously sense there is something wrong with her, so they avoid talking and looking at her. Even Peter, who interacted more with Altlivia, felt detached from her. He didn’t look at her like he would look at Olivia and he didn’t talk to her like used to talk to Olivia. He was probably responding to her strangeness, but even in that seduction scene, I didn’t feel he sold, what he managed to sell last week: being a man in love. In a way, I like this, he’s obviously noticing there is something weird, but just like Walter and Broyles, his instinctive reaction is to avoid really looking at her. However, this can’t go on for long. Either Altlivia gets more efficient or she should be outed soon.

    So far, they’ve managed to sell, how it’s possible that Peter doesn’t realize the truth. It seems that we’re still in the same day of Olivia’s escape and Peter’s debriefing, and Peter is now focused on the machine. I understand Peter here, knowing that he could be responsible of billions of deaths and the destruction of one universe trumps anything else, it’s believable that this issue takes up most of his mind. He didn’t bother to go back to Altlivia to finish, what she started, so that chemistry between Altlivia/Peter, that Joshua Jackson mentioned, is kind of… lacking, don’t you think? Let’s see how this goes in future episodes, but it doesn’t seem like Peter is too enthusiastic about the relationship. Again, I think this is part of his subconscious detecting something very wrong, much like Peter would not call Walter “dad” without knowing why.

    Walter on the other hand was pretty much perfect… funny, endearing and heartbreaking. I’m very much looking forward to his friendship with Astrid, since the father/son warmth is gone. Also, is it me or is Astrid looking even more beautiful than ever? She’s absolutely gorgeous!

    As for Walter and Peter, I know where this is going, but it’s killing me. Their relationship is the best thing in the show for me, so I’m not looking forward to having them acting like colleagues and that’s it. Peter is aware that Walter saved his life, so it seems his relationship with Walter is about paying his dues by staying with Walter and working with him. As long as their relationship is about work and not about father/son bonding, they will be fine, those are Peter’s limits. This is too heartbreaking, but I hope they can mend their relationship eventually.

    Walter giving his condolences to Nina and giving her that awkward hug was one of the highlights of the episode. Now that he owns Massive Dynamic, I’m looking forward to seeing him interacting with Nina and the scientists there.

    I’ll give Peter extra points for that line about preferring blonds. Not quite, the line I expected, but close enough.

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    • LMH says

      Thanks for that! Altivia is very dismissive, cocky and disrespectful of Newton which I think is a grave mistake. Who the hell does she think she is? I don’t care that she is so talented in marksmanship, physical prowess, etc., she is just not likable to me anymore. Frankly, I felt she acted like a complete you know what in this episode and I wanted to smack her! Having her pitted in scenes against Newton just makes me like Newton that much more. There was potential for her to be a great counter point to our Liv, but she doesn’t seem to have the same moral development or character that comes anywhere near our Liv. Long story short, I think she is too much of an opposite compared with Olivia for me to like her yet. Let’s hope she grows in feeling and compassion for the people over here.

      “UberLivia” or our Olivia+AltLiv on the other side is the far more likable character and not just because of how much I adore our Olivia. She will have the “brakes” of her old memories that will give pause to the cockiness and add an Oliviaesque reflectiveness that is deeper and causes more mental/emotional/moral conflict for her which is always easier for viewers to invest in. So I much as I enjoyed this episode, I look forward to going back to the other side and exploring the mindscape of Uberlivia!

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      • number six says

        Thanks for that! Altivia is very dismissive, cocky and disrespectful of Newton which I think is a grave mistake.

        Heh! I’m very protective of my favorite villains. Newton is too awesome to be replaced in my affections anytime soon. Besides, she lacks the British accent.

        Seriously though, I hope she calms down in future episodes. She bugs way too much.

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  14. Loti says

    Anyone else think that the train came from the other side? Perhaps theres a third entity out there, trying to kill Peter, who knows?

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    • fedorafadares says

      Wow. I hadn’t really considered that, but what if it was sabotage by someone else on OUR side — like ZFT.

      Gee, I wonder if ZFT planted “the box” on this side years ago.

      So many unanswered questions!

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  15. hal says

    this ep. was more like filler to set up the coming stories.. tho there was some significant developments.. it felt like i was just waiting for some really COOL stuff to happen.. and it was over before i knew it. :X … the dying people were pretty cool tho ;)

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  16. pacey bishop says

    Peter and Walter’s relationship is just how I expected it to be at this point. They’re showing us the two most common human flaws, the inability to want to listen and the inability or fear of saying sorry. It’s always like that, isn’t it? The timing is always different for both parts, too. Since the one that’s been hurt will have to feel like they’re ready to sit down and listen. It’s a shitty circle, but what can you do. Deep down, they’re just like any other father and son. Say you have a fight with your parents for whatever reason, the next day, are you more inclined to quickly apologize and talk about what happened or are you more inclined to avoid them for a while so things won’t get worse and then try to talk about it? Or better yet, pretend it never happened? Because many times in a parents/son or daughter relationship we conform easily and quickly, so the apology never comes and we move on with our lives as if it’s alright, like a silent apology and a silent acceptance of apology.

    Until another fight or something like a fight happens, then one or the other will use what happened previously to attack the other. That’s what goes on when a big issue gets ignored for too long, at some point it’ll explode. But that’s okay, because he’s your father and he has to deal with you for life, or that’s okay because he’s your son and he has to deal with you for life. And Walter knows that if Peter actually came back instead of staying on the other side, that their relationship has at least a little hope still and can be saved, unlike last season, where he was basically unsure about everything and freaking out thinking Peter had indeed left him. They just need time, like he’s constantly saying. That’s really what I think is happening/will happen – at some point they’ll address the issue, but for now, they feel more comfortable and even safe with what they have.

    As for AltLivia, anyone else had a laugh when she realized Olivia had a photographic memory and went like “how am i gonna do that?”

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    • number six says

      Agreed about the relationship between Walter and Peter. I’m thankful that there isn’t full on rage on Peter’s side and it’s evident, that Peter still loves Walter very much, otherwise he wouldn’t be willing to be with him on such good terms.

      But the trust is broken and they can’t go back to their father/son relationship. I wonder if that will ever be repaired. I really hope so. And I also hope that we get more scenes with those two, because they are absolutely fantastic.

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  17. jophan says

    I thought Walter was a lot too out-there this week. The whole “feed the cow cocoa beans to get chocolate milk” was stupid. He wouldn’t have pulled that even in the first half of S1. The hug with Nina was over the top, too. I realize he’s destabilized by the damage to his relationship with Peter, but he made more sense in the supermarket breakdown than he did here.

    I liked Peter snapping at Bolivia about her “hard on all of us” line. Olivia (from his perspective) accepted a lot of Walter’s worst deeds with minimal pushback. But he’s in a major emotional crisis, and she’s not giving it as much weight as it deserves. In the long run, it’s his to work through for himself. (BTW, does he even know about the three Cortexiphan kids sacrificed to get him back? Has anyone told him?)

    Otherwise, it seemed a little slow. I’m happy to see Broyles get more involved; he needs to know the situation with the machine.

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    • Page 48 says

      Walter was indeed ridiculous this week. Someone was trying way too hard to make up for his absence last week (which I pretty much enjoyed).

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  18. says

    Thinking on Broyles question of how or why pieces of the machine are over here. Just a thought: but could this be Observers at work here? It’s not the first time we’ve seem them hide a weapon. Could they have scattered the pieces of the machine throughout the universes in order keep either side from having the device?

    Also, yay for seeing and hearing Astrid more. She’s spent 2 years babysitting Walter in that lab and it’s about time the writers acknowledged that. Other than Peter, Astrid has always been there, and even forgave him for dosing her with a needle.

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  19. says

    I would love to rename this episode to ‘Pandora’s Music Box’. Don’t open it, or else…
    Fantastic episode. Loved to be ‘over here’ once again the first time this season.
    Massive show that surrounds Walter and Peter aswel.
    Many jokes this eisode: Walter: “There was a massage parlor around the corner. I used to get off here.”Get off! Walter! You dirty old man! :D
    During the readin of the will, Nena was mentioned as Bell’s right hand. Right hand. Sure! :D
    But what a bombshell in the end when Walter was revealed as the sole shareholder of Massive Dynamic. W-O-W!!

    It was a bit expected of course but what a shocker! What will be the future now? Walter vs. Walternate?!? Peter in the middle? And what will happen now to Nina? And hów honest will she be towards Walter?

    And then there’s still the link between Nina and Olivia… and also between Nina and Broyles, oh yes!!

    Haven’t seen the Observer the first time, so i’m gonna rewatch now. This one is in my top 3 favs. :)

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    • Hatch says

      “There was a massage parlor around the corner. I used to get off here.”

      Ha! I heard the line, but didn’t pick up on the connotation.

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        • LizW65 says

          I got it. :D
          I love how they get stuff past the radar all the time by being so straight-faced about it, while most other shows would have delivered that line with a wink and a nudge. Reminds me of the “Check his hard drive, check his floppy” exchange in Season One, when Walter and Peter didn’t seem to notice the phallic puns they were tossing around.

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          • LMH says

            I laughed so hard at the massage parlor line! I am still surprised that joke got through, but I guess TV-14 gives you some leeway with the innuendo. And I thought “bacon flavored pudding” was going to be the height of humor in this one. Walter was SO lovable in this one.

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  20. LizW65 says

    Last week’s episode was engaging, but this one literally had me on the edge of my seat. So many intriguing directions to go in…

    I think what struck me most watching was how much I miss the old interactions of the “big three”–Alt-Liv is no substitute for her original, and the odd little family unit that we’ve spent two years watching grow and develop has been well and truly demolished, but at the same time, I can’t wait to see how these new relationships unfold. Walter as the new head of Massive Dynamic? Will he have to move to New York and abandon the team, or will he leave most of the operation in Nina’s capable hands?

    I liked that the box tied into the main mythology of the show and wasn’t just another Case of the Week. Did Newton and Alt-Liv plan all along to bring Peter and the box together in such a way that he and the Fringe team didn’t suspect they were being manipulated? I assumed at first that Newton needed the box for himself, but the typewriter conversation at the end suggested that events had transpired exactly the way he wanted them to. (Unfortunately, I missed some of what the typewriter was saying, as our TV isn’t a widescreen and some of the words got cut off–can someone please post that exchange in its entirety? Thanks in advance!)

    As for this episode’s most enduring controversy…well, I’m on the “Peter definitely suspects something is wrong with Olivia” team. Several times he gave her a sidelong glance as if he could tell she was behaving oddly but hadn’t quite put two and two together yet. The sofa scene seemed awkward and “off” for both participants as well–Alt-Liv wasn’t fully engaged (obviously), and Peter seemed as relieved as she did when both their phones went off at once. I was reminded a little of that scene in “Klute” when the prostitute played by Jane Fonda looks at her watch while supposedly in the throes of passion…:D

    Well, I guess that’s all for now until I get in a rewatch–oh, wait. where was The Observer?

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    • number six says

      Did Newton and Alt-Liv plan all along to bring Peter and the box together in such a way that he and the Fringe team didn’t suspect they were being manipulated?
      Yes, that was the plan and it worked in the end.

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    • aci79 says

      I was just watching a snippet of last night episode. The underground scene where Peter forced Walter to come up with a solution on the spot for him to be in front of the device without getting hurt. Then Walter said, “Agent Dunham.” The look on her face… “what do you want from me? I’m just chillin back here.”

      I was kind of hoping for.. Agent Dunham, we need you. Your ability will protect Peter from the Device. or something like that… lol I would want to see her reaction to that. :D

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  21. LMH says

    So I think we have a new repetitive clue in s3 similar to all those darn tree easter eggs in s2: PENS.

    Last episode, we have Peter’s fabulous dying pen trick offer. In this one, while Altivia was on the phone with Newton in the alley, there was a line of graffiti behind her that included PEN, and she very deliberately said “It’s Dunham. You got a PEN?” (Not to mention “Penrose”).

    Where’s this going? Is it just a writer’s joke or perhaps something else. The pen is mightier than the sword (or as Sean Connery would say “The penis mightier” LOL). Will ideals/ideas, creativity somehow bring these two worlds together instead of war? I don’t know if that’s possible, but I think the symbol of the pen and the power of writing has obvious significance in relation to the Fringe story.

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    • says

      I didn’t notice the graffiti, but I took notice of the way Peter tapped the pen on the clipboard while signing out for the box. You may be on to something here. :)

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      • Ann_Louise says

        Also, the graffitti said that “the pen is mightier than the sword” – Peter can fix dying pens – the Other Defense Dept. has two swords crossed over a shield on its seal.

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        • LMH says

          Wow, so that was the full phrase? “Pen is mightier…?” I couldn’t make it out the first time. I’ll have to try to catch the whole thing again. If it is “Pen is mightier” then I feel special for guessing the theme.

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          • LMH says

            Upon further review, it does read “The Pen is Mightier.” Someone on Fringe Forum also confirms and brought up the “Find the Crack” pen from NWP. Forgot about that one.

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  22. number six says

    It is clear that Altlivia is not good for anyone, even less for Peter, but I found it really sad, that Olivia never talked to Peter about her favorite music. This showed me that, while Olivia might be a good friend, maybe she would be too gloomy for someone like Peter. I don’t know, I found that line from Peter really depressing for some reason.

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    • Ann_Louise says

      “This showed me that, while Olivia might be a good friend, maybe she would be too gloomy for someone like Peter.”

      But Peter is being shown to be closer to the people on the side he was brought to, rather than the side he was taken from. He’s working with Walter, and I get the feeling their relationship is the more “real” to Peter than Walternate’s rather chilly demeanor. While Peter may have an animalistic attraction to Altlivia from his side, the real love and companionship may be with Ourlivia, like his relationship with Walter.

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      • number six says

        Yes, Peter chose his family and his universe, and after this episode, I’m sure that the animal attraction, he has for Altlivia, is just his belief, that this is his Olivia. In fact, he seemed rather weirded out at some of the changes he saw in Olivia. He might dismiss the clues coming his way, because he already has enough on his plate, but I think he instinctively knows there is something wrong. Whether he’ll be able to rationalize it into “this is not my Olivia” or not, we’ll have to see.

        But my point is not Altlivia, I know she’s terrible. But what about Olivia? Talking about music is just a little detail, but talking about little things like music, etc… make relationships believable, just like talking about more serious matters. The Altlivia character is showing, what Peter and Olivia lacked. It wasn’t sexual chemistry, it’s this lighter side, that won’t come from Olivia. I know Peter loves her anyway, but I find it really sad, that he had same surprised reaction to “Olivia’s” taste in music as to Olivia’s declaration of love.

        Altlivia talking about taste in music also showed, how it’s possible that her stay over here could go undetected for a reasonable amount of time, because it’s easier to make mistakes with these kind of things and Peter knows very little to nothing about Olivia’s lighter side if she has one.

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  23. Hatch says

    People are getting all up in arms about how horrible it is that Altlivia executed the deaf man, and sure, it was a terrible thing to do.

    But think about the circumstances here. As far as she is concerned, the very existence of her world and everyone in it is threatened with obliteration. She is at war. Walternate has repeatedly planted seeds of misinformation in her mind, painting people from our side as inherently evil “creatures” that must be destroyed.

    All that considered, the fact that she even showed ANY reluctance to kill the man speaks volumes to me. She still killed him, but she’s at the very early stages of realizing that that we aren’t all a bunch of Nazis.

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  24. Hatch says

    …plus, the shapeshifters have been killing people over here for awhile now. It’s part of their mission.

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  25. Michael says

    Bono and an Irish bar! As an Irish man I’m Loving it! Of all the major differences between over there and here, the most important thing Bolivia needs to know is what Bono looks like and how Jamesons tastes.

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    • Ari says

      Well, the show is supposed to take place primarily in Boston, which is known for its Irish decent population! I love both Boston and u2 so the setting works for me.

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  26. LizW65 says

    The glyphs for this week spelled ALERT. Combined with last episodes “A-M-B-E-R” message, the first two episodes of Season 3 give us AMBER ALERT, the well-known child abduction bulletin.
    Could refer to the amber quarantine substance used in the AU, or to Peter’s abduction as a child. I believe this is the first time that two sets of glyphs have spelled out a message in conjunction–this reinforces the idea that the two episodes together are considered a two-part season premiere.

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  27. Elaine says

    “As for AltLivia, anyone else had a laugh when she realized Olivia had a photographic memory and went like “how am i gonna do that?”

    ~~~

    I did. :-)

    I thought this episode was a really nice follow-up to the premiere, because it continued the set up for the converging of both stories and likely what we’ll see in towards season end.

    The Walter/Peter scenes held this aspect of heartbreak and sadness that I was expecting, but realized as the episode unfolded, I wasn’t truly prepared for it. John Noble and Joshua played that tension, familiarity and emotional strain perfectly. It felt like our Peter has finally grown up in just a few short days after his…travels, for the lack of a better word. There’s a longing to reconcile with Walter…to try and understand, but the geniune loss of how to even process what he knows now will likely keep them at a distance for a while. It gives the show an entirely different feel that compliments the fractured, impending danger that is a running undercurrent of the narrative, imo.

    Walter and Astrid. Could the two of them be any more endearing together? I absolutely love Astrid’s devotion to Walter. I honestly don’t think there’s much he could do where she wouldn’t be in his corner. I loved how she really pushed him to go past his fear of further rejection from Peter by giving his side of the story. It didn’t turn out ideally, but it was a step forward. I also loved that he sought her out after learning that Bell left him ‘MD’. I can only imagine how this is going to impact Nina.

    I thought the creep factor in this episode was tops. Everything from the unsettling effect that box had on people to the midgets head exploding. Yuck.

    Was it just me, or did Altivia hold a level of disdain for what Newton is (presumedly)? Unless there was a scene that was cut to explain why she was so short and testy towards him, I came away with the impression that she doesn’t particularly care for him–but it has little if anything to do with there being a power struggle between the two.

    Speaking of Altivia. I know many of you have stated that you don’t care for her or this storyline, and I can appreciate that, but I honestly felt the writers did the one thing that kept this storyline credible–having Altivia educate herself about our society, culture and more importantly about Olivia. I thought this proved to be particularly useful when it came to the excuses she provided when her actions didn’t match up with how Olivia would behave. You could literally see her adjusting on the fly.

    Unlike Olivia, she doesn’t have the benefit, if it can be called that of having Olivia’s memories implanted in her mind. She is in essence, winging it. And what better way than to study the person she’s attempting to convince people that she is?

    As far as Peter’s cluelessness…give the guy a freakin’ break. I don’t know how you even begin to process what he’s just discovered about his entire life. To say he’s distracted is an understatement. If he’s not putting the subtle clues together just yet, then I don’t see that as implausible or understandable. Not that much time has passed, and I would imagine the differences are a welcome change since Olivia is usually so much more emotionally closed off.

    One final thing…Broyles finally has another office, and this one may be even more pimpish than the last one! ;-)

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  28. Oneiros says

    When I see this (presumably) vital component of “The Machine” which kills organic life in a limited radius but leaves everything else intact it makes me wonder… does Walternate think their universe is beyond repair, and , since it’s all the fault of the people on our side, simply plan to kill all of the human residents over here and then initiate some sort of mass migration? Sort of the ultimate version of a Neutron Bomb?
    There was a quick shot of a dead rat as Peter walked down the train tracks, and if I remember correctly it was bleeding from the ears as if it too had been killed by the ultrasonic waves from the Box. Maybe the importance of Peter as a component isn’t as much to power the device as it is to attenuate it, so it only kills Homo sapiens. No sense in migrating to a planet devoid of all mammalian life, right?

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  29. jacksonheights says

    I wish Josh Jackson would press the writers to flesh out Peters role. Peter is definitely a plot device which is pretty evident here. He agrees with Walter in the lab that they shouldn’t examine the machine and then takes it home with him at the end of the episode. He blames Walter for his kidnapping and the damage to the Alt Universe, but then babysits him at the reading Bell’s will as if nothing had ever happened. He crosses over to the Alt Universe and then crosses back without talking to his mom, after having a big emotional moment with her. I can’t imagine it can be easy to play someone with constantly changing motivations.

    That said last weeks episode had me on the edge of my seat and I was looking forward to this weeks episode from the promos. The mythology was there, Walter, Peter, Alt-Olivia and one of my favorites Newton too. They even gave us an exploding head (like in the Cure) but something seemed off. Walter reverted back to season 1 sensibilities which were in keeping with his just being released from a mental institution but seemed oddly out of place here. The plot twist was great with the doomsday machine being brought here for Peter to discover and study. I am hoping Rocco’s review can shed some light on why this episode didn’t seem to cut it.

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    • Nick says

      Well, they have to try and keep some of the quirkiness that makes Walter..Walter. He did have parts of this brain removed, never forget :)

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    • says

      I agree with your first point. Peter is all over the place. “hey Petermeister, why keep the box? Umm destroy it!”

      At this point Peter is being set up to have the biggest cream pie thrown in his face on all fronts.

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  30. Alison says

    So far I am really enjoying the new season, but I’m worried about the possibility of cancellation. I hear that the viewer numbers are quite poor. Such a shame for such an amazing show. :(

    Crossing my fingers in hoping it improves!

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    • Nick says

      All Fox cares about is numbers. It seems like the other networks are less harsh in their cancellation procedures. I mean, they cancelled Lone Star after 2 episodes. They give a 8 year old powerhouse (24) what…4 weeks notice when they cancelled it, so the writers couldnt even manage to write a proper ending. I would SO wish that Bad Robot could set their own end date on Fringe like they did with Lost.

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  31. says

    I, like others, thought that this was a very good show but was less than what I was expecting. It felt like a mid-season show to me, not like a part 2 of a premier. But overall it was very entertaining and gave us some good information.

    I think the writers are definitely trying to have us dislike Altlivia. I agree that she seems very shallow and remarkably condescending towards Newton (while he in comparison is still very classy). They did nothing to show us her actual vulnerability except for a very slight hesitation and lame “I’m sorry” to someone who can’t even hear her when she kills him. Which, by the way, was completely stupid! Okay, we’ve established she’s trying to prove herself, blah, blah, blah, but at the very least take this poor guy out of your apartment! Pretend you’re taking him to HQ for questioning then do it somewhere else. Not where you’ll have to clean up blood and find a way to get rid of the body. Dumb! Yes, she’s doing a good job and learning about Olivia and about this culture and she’s saying all the right things to cover for herself, but these are her only redeeming qualities that I can see for now. I expect the writers are having us start here so that they can redeem her down the road and we will like her. I sure hope so because it’s not fun to watch someone you have no respect for.

    As for Peter, again as others have said, I think he is finding irregularities with her behavior which at some point will add up to a pattern which will convince him of who she really is. But right now, her “irregularities” have gotten him a slow dance in a bar and some action on the couch. The guy is finally getting a little action after 2 years! He’s enjoying it and not looking for reasons. By the way, I thought it was funny during their dance at the bar that he cradled her gun in his hand. Funny.

    I also loved the way that Peter and Walter’s relationship is being portrayed right now. I think it’s spot on. Peter definitely loves Walter but can’t quite get himself to go over everything yet. It’s a lot to digest. So in the meantime, he’s going on as normal. I was so proud of Walter for taking the initiative and trying to talk to Peter about it (after Astrid’s urging). It’s as if he’s realized that he can’t go back to his days of keeping a secret and ignoring what needs to be done. He’s taking it on and it’s Peter who needs the time. I liked that bit.

    I thought Nina was fantastic in this episode! There are some new and interesting things I want to find out about her and Bell. What was in her letter?? And yes, she did play the vulnerable role well. We have known that she and Walter were much closer when they were younger and right after that awkward hug you can see the buds that they used to be. Just a glimpse but it was perfect.

    And we have an answer about Newton now. He’s been over here for 18 years. How does he do it? Does he have a mercury slushy every day? Or is he a different breed of shapeshifter? And how much of that time was his head severed? All very interesting.

    Very much looking forward to how these story lines are going to progress!

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    • number six says

      And we have an answer about Newton now. He’s been over here for 18 years. How does he do it? Does he have a mercury slushy every day? Or is he a different breed of shapeshifter? And how much of that time was his head severed? All very interesting.
      We only saw one shapeshifter, that needed mercury supplements, the one that took Charlie’s form and that was, because Charlie managed to shoot him, before the shapeshifter killed Charlie.

      Astrid was fantastic in this episode. Peter needs time, but I’m sure he will eventually forgive Walter. In the meantime, I’m happy that Walter can count on Astrid for moral support.

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    • Jodie says

      “By the way, I thought it was funny during their dance at the bar that he cradled her gun in his hand. Funny.”

      I thought the same thing! Not only was it weird that Altivia would be so openly carrying it (not something you see on this side even from off-duty police), but then Peter cradles it. Hysterical.

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  32. mlj102 says

    There have been some really great comments here and I have enjoyed reading what others have to say about this episode…

    bdp: “I also think a big part of it for me is that I see a shift in Altlivia coming where she becomes less hardened and militaristic against this side and at least somewhat understanding.”

    That’s what I’ve been expecting as well, and I still expect them to go that route in some way or another… but I guess it just isn’t what I expected. I guess I feel the way I do about her because I don’t feel like there’s any reason to care about her or her mission at this point. Don’t get me wrong; from the very beginning, I’ve argued that the other side characters — even Walternate — aren’t necessarily evil. I can see their point-of-view of the situation. But I don’t feel like we’ve gotten to explore alternate Olivia’s character in a way that makes me feel the situation she finds herself in. I don’t understand what’s motivating her. I can’t relate to her. I don’t feel like there’s a reason to support her or sympathize for her. Right now all she is is someone who has infiltrated our side, is pretending to be the team leader and is deceiving the rest of the team in the process. She seems full of herself, demanding, not very easy to work with, fake, and she’s willing to kill an innocent person for no real reason. Sure, she’s more “lighthearted and fun” but even that doesn’t appeal to me because there doesn’t seem to be a foundation to it, so it comes across as if this is all a game to her and she’s not taking her mission seriously. So that particular aspect of her character that should be likable is actually backfiring, in my opinion, because it conflicts with the other things we’ve seen of her and the things that are going on.

    So while they could very well go the route of showing alternate Olivia start to sympathize with our side and to question Walternate’s actions, they’re going to have to do a lot better than they did in this episode if they expect me to believe it and to be accepting of her character as she experiences that change of heart.

    “Also I think that some of her responses were actually very on point with what our Olivia would have said”

    Agreed. I’ll admit that some of the things fit. And, I’ll also give her credit for being an extremely good liar. Both times Peter seemed particularly suspicious of her, she came up with a great cover story: when he was surprised at her expressing an interest in music, she had the believable excuse that seeing alternate Olivia and how she could be different had changed her, and when she proceeded to go to the scene on her own, the excuse that she didn’t want to pull Peter away from a moment when he needed to be with Walter was rather typical of Olivia. Still, I find things to argue with in both instances.

    First, her excuse of seeing alternate Olivia causing her to implement certain changes is believable, but it can only go so far. She would not make such drastic, fundamental changes so quickly. Those kinds of changes typically take time and start out slowly, not all at once you’re a completely different person.

    As for the second one, sure, Olivia would be thoughtful of Peter like that, but she still would have made some effort to keep him involved in the developments of the case, rather than leaving him completely in the dark. And she was definitely suspicious in that whole scene… the way she was there all alone, then found a way to excuse herself from the scene as soon as Peter showed up… what’s with that? I found it quite odd that she was clearly charging forward with a relationship with Peter when it suited her purposes, but then in moments like that, she was completely uninterested in him and very distant. And that kind of behavior should come across as suspicious to him.

    The whole scene when Peter came to her apartment, and she proceeded to distract him from noticing the blood was so unlike Olivia that I can’t possibly believe Peter fell for it. Olivia doesn’t believe in temporary fixes or distracting herself. She confronts the matter head on. She doesn’t try to run away or pretend it doesn’t exist. She tries to solve it. And that whole line about being scared? Peter has seen Olivia when she’s scared. He’s seen the way she doesn’t open up about her emotions. So that alone should have sent off immediate red flags.

    So while alternate Olivia could occasionally pull off a comment that somewhat resembled our Olivia, and she was actually a pretty good liar, I’m still not buying it because there was far too much in her words and her actions that were completely out of character with our Olivia.

    FinChase: “I have to admit that the moment that moved me the most in the episode was the little video clip of our Olivia. It just underscored for me how much I miss her.”

    100% agree! Wasn’t that little moment amazing?! It was so refreshing to see our Olivia and it made me miss her even more. I especially liked the way it contrasted the differences between the two Olivias, which is also a compliment to Anna Torv’s acting. John Noble gets a lot of praise for the way he depicts two very distinct Walters — and he deserves all of that praise — but that scene showing one Olivia watching the other Olivia was incredible as there were very clear and distinct differences in both of them: the clothes, the posture, the way they talk, the attitude, mannerisms, etc. All those subtle things and I am completely in awe at Anna Torv’s ability to convey all of that. Well done.

    On the other hand, it’s one more thing to emphasize my disbelief that Peter and the others could possibly be unaware of the switch. That short little clip of our Olivia made it completely clear that the two, while similar, are also completely different, and there are aspects of our Olivia that alternate Olivia will never be able to imitate. And those are also the fundamental things that can’t be excused by things like “seeing another me has changed me”. Sure, seeing another version of yourself would certainly change you, but she would still fundamentally be the same reserved, serious, “haunted” person that she is.

    As a side note about that little clip, I found it interesting that, of all the episodes and cases they could have had our Olivia discussing in that report, they chose Dream Logic. I wonder if there’s a significance we’re supposed to gain from that episode or a particular connection it has with other things going on.

    FlashWriter: “I completely agree, MLH.”

    Is that alternate universe me? :)

    In conclusion, I don’t mean to sound overly harsh or critical in my comments, but that tends to be the tone that comes out when I have a particularly strong opinion or reaction towards something. As I’ve said, it wasn’t a bad episode — there were definitely redeeming qualities to it. And I can see the points-of-view others have made to explain alternate Olivia or why the others haven’t seemed to notice it’s her yet. But none of that is enough to win me over and convince me that alternate Olivia is someone I should like or that it’s understandable that the others haven’t noticed they are working with an imposter. And those are two things that are fundamental to the story being told. So it bugs me. And I hope that future episodes will do a better job with these things. I would love it if they ultimately revealed that Peter and others were aware all along and that they were simply pretending to believe it was our Olivia. But until that happens, I have to believe what is being shown, and that is that they have no idea that it’s not their Olivia. And that idea really bothers me. But I will keep my fingers crossed that they will be able to pull this off in a satisfying way.

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    • says

      Yes it would be nice if a couple people started to question these changes in Olivia. It would also be nice to think that over here the plan is to watch and observe Altlivia. Who knows when we, as the audience, will get that satisfaction. Surely it won’t last till the mid-season “lowatus”?!

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  33. Ann_Louise says

    “… my theory is that Peter won’t have to go the route of destroying our universe to fix the other one and I don’t think he would be able to destroy either of them as evidenced by his talk with Altlivia in this episode. I think Peter’s search into the weapon will eventually lead him to discover a way to fix the other side while staying in ours at the same time.”

    On another board I mentioned the connection between the pen references the last two episodes. First, Peter offers to fix a dying pen, then the next episode features the graffitti “the pen is mightier than the sword”. We know that the Defense Dept Great Seal on the other side features two swords crossed over a shield. If the clues dropped are so big that even I can see then on first viewing, maybe they have a connection.

    -Thanks Fringe for adding the sucking sound of brains being removed from the half-skull to my library of gross out sounds you’ve burned in my mind. And the exploding little person’s brain, made even more shocking by the complete silence before it.

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  34. woody says

    great episode. i really hope Altlivia doesnt actually fall in love with peter: i don’t wanna see that happen. also i really thought the tattoo on the back of her neck would be the sign to give her away to someone eventually, but now that newton removed it, i dont know.
    Can’t wait to see what will happen with Olivia over there…ive got a feeling theyre gonna think of something awesome for when she gets her own mind back. I wonder if Henry from the taxi will come back into it?
    lol walter calling astrid aspirin in the beginning

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  35. Catherine says

    Peter so got caught being, well, male…lying to “Olivia” about preferring blondes. One reason Peter is going to be in self denial for awhile about any differences that he may notice in Olivia is that he NEEDS HER. His relationship with Walter is so messed up; Peter needs to be close to someone and Olivia fits the bill.

    Watching Walter and Peter last night was heartbreaking. I don’t like the way that relationship has gone. Writers! Fix them soon, please.

    Altivia saved Peter’s life because it’s her mission. He’s the key, to something. Man, Walternate is cold. Where’s that humanizing of his character John Noble hoped to do. Again, writers? Don’t keep us here long.

    I’m having a hard time so far enjoying the new “set up” so much. I really do prefer the three main characters together.

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    • number six says

      One reason Peter is going to be in self denial for awhile about any differences that he may notice in Olivia is that he NEEDS HER. His relationship with Walter is so messed up; Peter needs to be close to someone and Olivia fits the bill.

      He has so many reasons to not see the truth, that it’s incredibly painful. As much as he loves Walter, their relationship is understandably broken. He knows Olivia is the only one, that can understand, what he’s going through. His need of her will possibly blind him to a whole new level and when the truth is revealed, I fear that he won’t trust anyone else or himself anymore.

      Fix them soon, please.

      I don’t know if I want them to be fixed soon, but I hope they have many scenes together. As much as I love Astrid, what draws me to this show is the Walter/Peter relationship, so whether the scenes are funny or heartbreaking, I need my fix of the Wonderful Bishops.

      Maybe Astrid should have a word with Peter, just like she did with Walter. That wonderful woman seems to know how to fix broken relationships… Did I mention that I love her?

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  36. says

    I liked this episode, though I thought there were some parts that were off (note: Peter/Altlivia).

    Walter reverted back to the way he was in Season 1 b/c of the position he’s in with Peter.

    The awkward hug he shared with Nina reminded us that he, “Bellie”, and Walter were at one time very close.

    M.Dynamics can be a “publicly held” company; Bell and now Walter, just have to hold at or more than 51% of the stock.

    Peter — he actively took part in this ep., getting the “box”, realizing it was part of the “doomsday machine”, and then worked on it some more after he disarmed it.

    Peter — bad bad bad, didn’t even know it was Altlivia he was kissing. Come on, Peter, you’ve gone through all kinds of dren w/the real Olivia, you don’t realize the difference?

    I fail to see any way that I’m supposed to like AltLivia. I think it would be grand if the real Olivia came back and dusted her. Newton I hadn’t liked before now, but after his interaction w/Altlivia, I like him and am rooting for him.

    The best thing that could happen is the real Olivia gets back to our side and wastes Altlivia. Newton could help her.

    the pens — that started in last season’s “Northwest Passage”.

    Oh yeah, I forgot to mention; both Sam Weisses are over here: the “younger one” who helps people, and the “older one” who runs the store with the typewriter. When Altlivia asked to use the typewriter, he was stunned.

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  37. vlada_vvv says

    well, i think that The Box became one of my favorite episodes (the second after “Peter”). How great was that! My hands were shaking a little bit after watching it… Yeah. It was waaaaaaaaaaaaaaaay more interesting and outstanding than i had expected.
    How many events were in there, how much feelings and emotions! How much new and fascinating information did we gained from this episode!

    Walternate’s plan on Peter, Doomsday Device and Alivia – Oh, how cunning was that!

    Peter and Walter relationships… I gotta say that was just awesome. Everything that’s connected with them moves in the right way i think)

    Alivia and Peter relationships. Well, after watching The Box i finally liked Alivia) Oh, how insidious were she and her actions! I’d rather say Alive was deliciously insidious in this episode and i love it! This Alivia is amazing. I liked the scene with the bleeding “bathroom door” very much.

    I also enjoyed to see the interaction between Alivia and Newton. He was such a…. Human in that scene with here… It makes me think of “Do shape-shifters dream of Electric Sheep” even more.

    Astrid was great. Really. It was the first time on the show when I noticed The Character in her. Not just a Walter’s baby-sitter, not just a background of his lab but HER. And when Walter finally came to her to announce WHAT William left to him… I was gonna cry, honestly. In that moment I saw how far Walter is from Alive/Peter tandem now but i also saw how Walter’s and Astrid’s characters have developed since the middle of the second season.

    And finally…. Nina. And. Walter. It’s worth to watch this episode at least because of the scene in MD. That was awesome. Nina seemed to be waiting for that awkward but very warm hug from Walter. She gasped convulsively almost crying in that moment(( She was need that hug and those condolences from Walter. She played her vulnerable part very well.
    The last will and testament of William Bell. This scene exceeded all of my expectations. The text was very philosophic and meaningful. Nina was amazing again. Walter was amazing as well. We’ve finally learned that there were a romantic bond b/w Nina and Bell. The bell from Bell as a “memento”… It was very touching. “I was your right hand…” – indeed)
    I saw some people who were wondering what was in Nina’s envelope. Well, i think that it was kind of a small fortune…

    “We gather knowledge faster than the freedom. By now i trust you have ample reserves of both…” – just great words.

    And as a conclusion “Don’t be afraid to cross the line Walter” otherwise you’ll never win this war.

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    • number six says

      Peter and Walter relationships… I gotta say that was just awesome. Everything that’s connected with them moves in the right way i think)
      I agree with this. One of my biggest fears was how their relationship would be handled in season 3. I didn’t want them to revert to the animosity of S1, but I didn’t want Peter to forgive him any time soon.

      I think that Walter has to regain Peter’s trust and a simple apology can’t cut it. I hope there will be some drama between those two, because they do it to perfection and because they are my favorite thing about the show.

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  38. Matt says

    I feel like I’m on a different end of this. I felt that the episode was okay but not exceedingly great. I gave it a solid 7. But there were a few things that really bothered me, namely 1 – Peter and Walter.

    Peter isn’t showing the hurt, feeling betrayed Peter that, in my mind, he should be still showing towards Walter. I realize that the relationship isn’t fully redeemed, but it seemed Peter was mostly just irritated every now and then by Walters randomness (the beans cooking) than irritated that Walter lied to him and kidnapped him.

    Even taking into consideration his connection he has with Walter being the father he knew, the father he grew to love (or near love) over the first 2 season, and the man who risked his life twice to save him. I’ve also taken into consideration that Peter must feel just as betrayed by Walternate. I certainly would think that Walternate wanted me back only to power a machine to destroy the world I knew (and possibly myself in the process) if I had gone through the same thing and seen the picture with fire coming out of my eyes and mouth.

    Seeing a figure like Walter who would cross worlds to save him (not use him) and try to be with him, would absolutely absolve some of those issues…but I still definitely felt it was too nice. There doesn’t seem to be very much tension…but maybe I perceived it wrong or missed something in there. I was also a bit bothered by Peter and Altlivia, but then – being a guy – know that Peter is probably a bit blind to the things that don’t seem to fit “Olivia”, at least for a bit while this romantic relationship is still new and Peter had never observed Olivia in a romantic relationship so maybe she is like this when there’s romance.

    I don’t know, I wanted to see what other people felt about these things and maybe give me a perspective I’m not seeing. I still liked the episode, just didnt’ think it was as good as the premiere (which kind of blew me away).

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    • Catherine says

      Walter’s a broken man. I think Peter acknowledges that, and he’s preoccupied with this machine and Altivia right now.

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  39. Edgesight says

    Found the Observer!

    Walking past Newton, coming down the stairs on his right as Newton walks towards us, after he leaves the box with the little guy in the subway tunnel. It’s a very quick flash.

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