Walter travels to the Alternate Universe to assist in the investigation of a Fringe event with ties to both worlds. Meanwhile, David Robert Jones reveals his next target.
Loading ...
FRINGE: 4.18 The Consultant
Article by Roco The Last
Roco is the editor of Fringe Bloggers and multiversal Gatekeeper. You can also find him at Seriable.com
Roco has written 3160 awesome articles for FringeBloggers!
Previous post: FRINGIE OF THE WEEK: 4.17 Everything In Its Right Place
Next post: FRINGE: 4.19 Letters Of Transit Promo
Science Channel Confirms Fringe Hasn't Been Cancelled
Fringe Seasons 1-4 On Netflix
FRINGE Final Season & Complete Series DVD Release Date & First-Look
Almost Human - 4 Minute Featurette Teases Upcoming J.H. Wyman Series
Team Fringe's New Show: Almost Human - 4 Minute Trailer
{ 295 comments… read them below or add one }
I loved Altstrid saying why she didn’t like funerals. Nice callback to “Making Angels.”
Like:
4
“We’re in the business of making money.”
Why, Fringe…was that an indirect stab at our dear Mr. Reilly?
Well-loved. Like:
43
lmao, nice catch
Like:
4
Oh man, that is too good! XD
Like:
4
Nice one. Thumbs-Up
Like:
5
I laughed so hard….
Like:
4
Take that one step further and look what happens to the guy in the scene… Before he can “fire” the employee. Intentional or not, I’ll accept that as a cathartic, metaphoric “middle finger”
Well-loved. Like:
14
OMG you’re right lmao
Like:
2
Nice catch, awesome. I just hope this joke doesn’t cost the 5th season *shivers*
(we know that Mr. Reilly watches the show lol)
Like:
7
I’d say by now the decision has already been made.
Like:
4
Ok seriously. That scene with walter commenting on peter not being home last night. really? its like:
Walter: lol my son has a girlfreind. hey peter, where were you?
Peter: well-
Walter: you were at olivia’s weren’t you?
Peter: ye-
Walter: having SEX right? because you guys are like so in love and stuff and that’s really what this whole show is about and your love is just so wonderful and magical and special that we need to bash the viewers in the face with it in every episode even when its totally irrelevant and has no context within the plot at the time!!!
Hot debate. What do you think?
9
What’s that? Walter being inappropriate?
Well-loved. Like:
11
its not walter. its the writers.
Like:
7
The dark side must require a stick up the rear…
Well-loved. Like:
14
Al, have you not seen Return of the Jedi?
“I’m afraid the deflector shield will be quite operational when your friends arrive.”
Palpatine has a freaking lightsaber up the rear. Kate just doesn’t like cheese.
Like:
5
THANK YOU
Like:
4
I’m a sucker for Sith lords. What can I say?
Like:
4
wow that’s not a personal attack at all.
Like:
4
I thought it was kinda funny.
Well-loved. Like:
26
I thought it was funny too, it shows Walter is very comfortable around his son and making jokes about his love life.
Well-loved. Like:
29
I agree with you Ian S.
Well-loved. Like:
17
C’mon, Walter always wanted them to get together and has made many comments in the past…this is pretty consistent with his character.
Well-loved. Like:
25
As you said, “It was kinda funny”…..but I think It could’ve been even funnier if it was the opposite of him been soooo aware of the love birds. He treats them like teens and it feels kinda awkward really. I would’ve loved if he says something like “This week I’ll make you , how about on Tuesday?”…and then Olivia and Peter could be the ones who laugh.
Like:
3
*I’ll make some breakfast…
Like:
0
That whole show was full of so much stuff going on….and that is what first popped in your head to comment on!?
Well-loved. Like:
14
Who are the real haters, huh? lol
Like:
5
you know what? you’re right. i am so sorry for ever having criticized this absolutely flawless show. what was i thinking? from now on ill be a complacent member of the flock just like you and not make a single critique of anything. Because it is truly the height of hubris to question the wisdom of the all-holy writers. Thank you, Sophia. Truly your comment has enlightened me. Go in peace my sister.
Like:
5
If you can call people haters because of your love for Lincoln, why can’t I say that you are hating P/O too? It was an amazing episode (which P/O almost don’t show their faces) with a lot going on e the first thing you have to say is this?
Stop with the drama, I didn’t say nothing about perfection of the show, or that the show is flawless, I have so many problems with this season but you chose to distort what you read in your favor, as always.
You say whatever you think here, me too. You’re constantly bugging people because they talk about Lincoln, let them be free if you appreciate so much to bash P/O and other things about the show. Don’t be hypocritical.
Well-loved. Like:
12
Baaa baaa.
Like:
2
So now Lincoln haters have the right to express their opinion, but P/O haters (well, or Peter haters anyway) are hypocrits?
I assume there is no room to be in beetwen, because Lincoln lovers and Lincoln haters are two types of people, that will never agree.
Like:
3
You’re funny Kid ! Thanks for the morning smile.
Like:
1
You’re welcome, and good morning (although it’s 15.00 where I live).
Like:
1
i was commenting as i watched it and it was early on in the episode. so yeah.
Like:
4
Relax ppl, everyone is allowed to have their opinions whether we agree or not!
Like:
3
Group hug around Fauxlivia. We will all be ok.
Like:
2
agreed people we can critique the show, we can say our opinions but we cannot bash eachother.
Like:
2
Sorry about that.
Like:
1
Like:
2
IDWTIA, but that P/O thing is getting kind of anoying, so I have to agree with Darth Kate about this one.
Fringe, don’t become Grey’s Anatomy!
Like:
3
ok there’s getting to be waay to many sith lords in here so im changing sh*t up….
Like:
1
Are you going through a spiritual rebirth ?
Like:
2
in a manner of speaking
Like:
3
Kate, I know that you are a bit of a firecracker, just like Altlivia, but please don’t get dragged down by all the mudslinging.
PS, I always enjoy your observations.
Like:
1
Alt Broyles is gonna die AGAIN!!
Like:
1
I’am glad he didn’t die lol
It was nice to see Our Broyles share a scene with his counterpart and one of them not be dead!
Like:
5
I’m glad he didn’t as well. But it would be interesting if he had, given the show’s circular nature.
Like:
4
That’s what I thought was going to happen too, remembering S3 and how AltLiv got back to the other side…..
Like:
1
Fauxliv is wasted off her a$$ ans i dont know whether to laugh or cry…
Well-loved. Like:
14
*and
Like:
6
I was laughing. Great scene with her and Walter though.
Well-loved. Like:
24
That scene between Alt-Livia and Walter, make me like her more. I never liked Alt-Livia before, but since the last episode I really start to like her.
That scene was very good! Make feel sorry for her.
And is that way she don’t drink!!!! She is very funny when drunk!!! XD
Well-loved. Like:
16
I’ve been liking her a lot more this season. She has more spunk that our Liv.
Like:
7
*than
Like:
1
AltLivia does not take alchohol nearly as good as our Olivia!
Like:
1
I know, it was a great scene. I really like when Walter was cooking eggs and her head was on Walter’s shoulder. That was nice.
Well-loved. Like:
18
That was a very sweet, endearing scene.
Like:
6
Another great episode. Looks like Fringe may finally be back.
Well-loved. Like:
20
Haven’t watched it yet. But, really ? Approval from Darth Kate ?
Like:
3
last week was the first step in the right direction.
Well-loved. Like:
10
Wow, Kate. Your approval is just the thing I need to enjoy Fringe again.
Like:
2
Well…miracles were mentioned in this episode.
Like:
1
Too funny! Good for you Darth Kate
Like:
1
This is the Fringe I love. Every episode counts.
Like:
3
@Darth Kate
Fringe was never gone to begin with, you probably just had to be patient enough to see where the writers were taking the story.
Overall, and although s4 has been the most criticized, I believe it offered us some of the strongest episodes (Standalones and/or Methalones) in the series. I for one have many favorite episodes picked from this season 4.02 4.06 4.08 4.09 4.12 > 4.14 ……
Well-loved. Like:
20
I hate to say this, but S4 is not even close, compared to good’ol Fringe, back on S1 & S2. Pinkner & Wyman’ s obssession with the Lincoln Lee character (not with Seth Gable, in particular, Alt-Link was a great, IMHO, character) left little room for OUR Fringe to develop even further. Anybody remember Sam Weiss? I am sure S4 would have been a lot greater with him together with the rest of the gang. Seriously, i do hope they wrap-up the season in a good way, depending on whether the show gets renewed or not (sniff…). But to be honest, a word to J.J., Orchi & Kurtzman, as Kate said many times: Give us better & STRONGER stories, this is not the Fringe we love & support.
Like:
7
Speak for yourself. I love and support Fringe 100 %.
Well-loved. Like:
16
That was mean, Betty. And ofcource i am speaking for myself, and just being honest, i just share some views similar to Darth Kate, regarding S4. Does that make me more or less supportive of the show?
Like:
5
It is the show *I* love and support. I love where it has come from, I can’t wait to see where it is going.
Like:
6
To a full 22 Episodes S5, hopefully…
Hot debate. What do you think?
8
Some may get caught up with you last sentence, but I get where you are coming from. It’s because you “love and support” the show that you feel the way that you do. If you didn’t, you wouldn’t still be watching, let alone commenting here
Our show has come a long way, and that’s why things like most of Lincoln’s story has driven me bonkers.
Writer 1: “oh let’s intimate there is some mutual attraction between Lincoln and Olivia to create drama/friction/whatever once Peter is back.”
Writer 2: ” yeah! That sounds great, because it worked so well for us last season. With so much story left to tell the loyal fans will LOVE that were going to spend a chunk of what could be our last season (again) giving them what they’ve been clamoring for…”
[The entire writers room together]
All: ” MORE LINCOLN!!!”
[Thunderous cheers, and self-congratulatory high fives all around]
Well-loved. Like:
11
lmfao
Like:
1
Im sorry to say that i think that is genuinely what the writers think we want though
Like:
4
NO WAY tell me the truth, you have a micro camera in the writer’s reunion room
Like:
2
And then, there is one of those awkward ‘Lincoln stares.’
Like:
3
As always i am kind of stunned that lincoln is really people’s biggest issue. it is really so incredibly minuscule compared to everything else that has been bogging down the show.
Hot debate. What do you think?
8
I agree with Darth Kate. And it’s not a matter of Lincoln or not Lincoln… it’s the atmosphere, the feel of constant danger, the tension between the characters that is finally back to how it was in Season 1 and 2. I really feel that the whole “Boom Boom Machine” story was the real problem; when instead of a real enemy and a real urgency you only get a machine that you assemble and then don’t know how to use, the storytelling is bound to go downhill. Not to mention the terrible, terrible romance, when a brother/sister dynamics for P&O was so much better.
I’m sooo happy that Fringe as I like it is finally back!
Well-loved. Like:
12
marry me.
Like:
4
Marriage shtick again?
Like:
0
I totally agree with your episode choices this season so far; although I might throw in 4:15 just because . . .
Like:
2
i saw where they took the story and i didn’t like it. its interesting that people always assume that i “just don’t understand.” maybe i just legitimately have a different opinion…
Like:
6
“(Standalones and/or Methalones)” Wouldn’t “methalones” be from “Breaking Bad”?
Like:
7
That’s the spirit Kate!
Like:
0
I’ve gotta say, that was a pretty epic episode of the show tonight gang.
I do share Kate’s opinion on that scene however:P
Hot debate. What do you think?
8
the writers seem to have lost any semblance of subtlety when it comes to P/Olivia.
Well-loved. Like:
12
You’re right, it was a bit cheesy
Like:
5
Can’t argue with that. I don’t have a problem with it honestly but yeah, it was cheesy as hell.
Well-loved. Like:
10
Just think they were having Walter make things uncomfortable like he used to do in season one.
Hot debate. What do you think?
9
it worked as comedy in season one because they *weren’t* actually in a relationship.
Like:
1
It’s really strange given how well written a lot of this episode was. Loved the exchanges between Walter & DrunkAltLiv, Broyles & DRJ, and the Astrids.
Picking a Fringie of the week is going to be tough.
Like:
7
Nah. Definite Broylnate win.
Like:
4
Agreed. I think it was you who commented on the circular nature of the show above. In S3, Broyles sacrificed himself not just to help Olivia get home, but because he knew he really couldn’t keep his family safe anyway. The world is tumbling down, and he’s put his faith in someone or something else to save it, and his family. I thought that was a nice touch they had him turn himself in.
Like:
1
I always thought broyles had to be a shapeshifter because the real broyles would never cooperate with DRJ
but when I realised that he did it because he didn’t want to lose his son and the fact that he still was a good person because he turned himself in made it believable to me.
I felt really sorry for him when he said “I’m sorry” to fauxlivia
great scene
Like:
2
and I also love the fact that the episode “the abducted” is now kinda connected to the mythology of the show!
Like:
2
I also like that we got to see Broyle’s son again, and that we got to see just what would tempt Broyle: that whereas his son was blind in S3, in this new reality, he is dying. I like the echo with Walter’s story, too, that these are men with morals and ethics, who are faced with losing someone they love, and having the power to change things (for good or for bad) with their choices.
It’s really kind of cool how we’ve gotten to see variations on our characters like this – different choices, different lives and they all end up doing the same kind of work, too!
Like:
1
NEXT WEEK. HOLY SHIT.
Well-loved. Like:
13
I know how you feel!!
Like:
3
Also, did anyone else wig out a little in the moment when our Broyles showed up at the machine, thinking that he was in on it along with AltBroyles?
Hot debate. What do you think?
8
A little bit. Then I felt bad about it.
Like:
3
A small second, yes. I was like …WTF… and then ooh. I was really kinda hoping he would go through with it, and then it would cut the worlds off from each other and then the reason for the totalitarian future would have been because of this. Then it would also explain 4×20 title, “Worlds Apart.”
Should have known better though, my theories rarely work out on this series.
Like:
4
Don’t feel bad my theories are rarely right when it comes to fringe.
Like:
1
I too was like, WTF, almost screaming, my heart was pounding in my throat… I was like ” Please, no, he can’t do that!!”. I was very, very happy when he surrended!!! I was very sorry about him!!!
Like:
1
That’s exactly what I thought too, and that maybe Walter would be stuck Over There until the finale and he and Peter would be Worlds Apart and they’d need the Cortexiphan kids to cross over just like in the season 2 finale! But, the writers have thrown us in a completely different direction :O
Like:
2
Jones might still get his way in Worlds Apart. I wouldn’t rule that out yet.
Like:
3
I loved how Broyles turned himself in .. I was really thinking he was going to destroy the machine and I was freaking out and then our Broyles stepped onto the screen and I just flipped ! Great twist
Like:
6
To meet our Broyles at the bridge…
Like:
1
It was weird though that he just randomly popped up since we didn’t see Alt Broyles call our Broyles, so for a second I thought they were actually working together or something.
Like:
3
Why did alt-Broyles need to go all the way to Liberty Island to turn himself in? He shouldn’t have brought Jones’ device anywhere near the machine.
Like:
0
Whoops, replied to the wrong comment there. But yeah, to meet our Broyles and also to be dramatic lol
Like:
0
I think we missed the confession seen unfortunately (that whole seen was done a bit odd, with Alt Liv and Lincoln 10 minutes behind or whatever), so I think Alt Broyles was feeling so overwhelmed and guilty that the only person he could confess to was the only one who would understand: himself.
Well-loved. Like:
18
*scene, where is my grammar today D:
Like:
1
I like that….really well said!
Like:
0
Maybe he thought he could have been followed by DRJ’s shapeshifters. So he keeps with the plan to avoid suspicious
Like:
2
Oh my God, so glad that Broyles was not that bad!! I was really glad!!!
Alt-Livia drinking, was the best scene ever! It was funny, and sad at the same time!!!!
What the hell DRJ wants!!?? Really, he is freaking crazy!!!!
Love this episode!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Well-loved. Like:
15
DRJ wants to destroy both universes and become god to the chaos that would ensue afterwards. Just like Stephen King’s the Crimson King.
Like:
0
WOW, pretty speechless about this one! It was so good I’m still salivating lol. Glad to see that AltBroyles was not a shapeshifter and his motives behind his actions. Loved AltLiv and Walter’s scenes.
Sorry Meana, in this universe we don’t call it peon, we call it Pwned! lol
Well-loved. Like:
11
I am speechless too. So much to like!! I was touched by the Broylesnate Walter connection–both doing anything to save their sons. Both decent men who were so decent that one turned himslf in and the other almost perished from his sense of guilt. I also loved Walter’s answer to Broylesnate’s question whether Walter would do the same thing again. He really has becomemris the old timeline Walter. Somehow this timeline balances things between the universes. Even Walter knows that Fauxlivia is fabulous and does not have a vagenda.
Hot debate. What do you think?
9
I’m really going to need to watch this again tomorrow, however I really loved, loved, loved the interaction between Walter and Fauxlivia (Altlivia, what can I say she’s growing on me, Fauxlivia just seems a bit harsh now).
Next week looks mind bending. Where’s a blue police box and a doctor when you need one!
Like:
6
I wonder if Jones stole youth from other children to give it to Broyles’ son. Chilling…
Like:
6
Brrrrrr
Like:
1
Broyles’ son was kidnapped and suffered from physical and psychological trauma. Isn’t that what the drugs were intended for. Because he sure came out of his shell.
Like:
2
Walter must be able to duplicate the magic drug that Jones gave to AltBroyles as well. So hopefully all will be well with his son.
Like:
0
Awesome episode!! Can’t wait to rewatch tomorrow! Missed the very beginning because local channel showing bad weather reports. I will have to wait until it’s on On demand! Still trying to wrap my brain around why Jones wants to collapse the universes!
Like:
3
Holy smokes. Loved the episode!!! Broyles has to be fringie of the week! Jones ought to be ashamed of himself for using a poor child to manipulate Broyles, but I guess not. nice to see Chris again, and thin
Was it just me or when Walter crossed over I thought he said there is my escort, and then he used the word prostitute when referring to Bolivia. Most have been sipping my wine at that moment.
Scenes for next week– beyond Epic. I will die if this the last season.
Like:
4
I totally heard that too! That was so funny!
Like:
1
He corrected himself, saying “escort, not prostitute.” He muttered it, but it was there. Like when “beaver meant something else in my day.”
Love Walter!
Like:
4
that was a great line had me in stiches, Walter i thought was extra fun in this episode! battle between him and altbroyles for fringie of the week, rewatch will be the telling!
Like:
1
Hmmmm…
I wonder if the ‘TBS’ tag on Broyles’ SUV has hidden meaning?
Like:
1
AltBroyles’ SUV
Like:
0
UN-.BE-.FREAKIN’-.LIEVABLY EXCELLENT EPISODE. That was phenomenal:
* Walter acknowledging Peter as his son TWICE. Plus allowing the two lovebirds together time to catch-up (yes, that was the cover for Peter not being in this episode much.)(I have commented before that it seems there is a disconnect between P/O since the twitterpated adrenaline rush of Episode 15. I don’t expect to see NCMO on screen in any episode, much less every episode, but…something sure does seem different. I go back and forth on it.)
* Good coda to BTWYNB, with the pier and Wheeler, and even Fauxlivia and Lincoln. Walterism on the pier: “Anything is possible, even Santa.”
* Walter with the Rockin’ Redhead of the Redverse. Excellent scenes throughout with those two. Bonus Walterism about his overnight stay in Fauxlivia’s apartment: “I won’t sleep naked.”
* The wrong Lincoln was in the coffin. (OK that was snarky.)
* Astrid giving Kick-Astrid the coffee. Good coda to the eppy earlier this season. Plus the two Astrids working on the bridge together in the phone call between universes, really cool
* Alt Broyles…he did it for his son, which is a family angle several here have mentioned previously(it was good to see Alt Diane and Chris again. No mention of the Candyman, though). It was cool that he turned himself in to our Broyles.
* Bad, Bad Nina now thinks she is toast.
* Is there any criminal more deliciously evil than DRJ? Jared Harris hit this one out of the park. DRJ showing up at Alt Broyles house was very much a “who’s your daddy?” moment. His disdain for love was a coda to TEOAT, his last dialogue with Olivia before he went through the portal. The velocity and crescendo of the season is growing, and I am eager to see why Jones wanted to collapse the universes.
* The only thing that would have made this show better would have been Walter and Walternate facing each other.
Overall, an outstanding episode. Looking forward to next week and the rest of the season. And ALL of Season 5.
Well-loved. Like:
12
I was actually very surprised I…I mean, Walternate…was not in this episode. I don’t know, someone planning to sabotage the machine seems like something you’d warn the top dog in the entire building about.
Like:
5
I was too, after this fabulous episode ended, I thought – Walternate! Where was he? Did Broylnate call him before going over? What’s he going to think of his Fringe division now, with Lee (the original and best one, IMHO) dead, and Broyles working with DRJ? Will AltLIv be put in charge?
Like:
1
I have a question for everyone. Alt Broyles asked Walter that if he knew the consequences would he still do what he did. Would you guys have done the same as Alt Broyles (and Walter for that matter) knowing the consequences?
Like:
2
No, absolutely not. A single person is not worth killing thousands, if not millions more. The needs of the many outweigh the needs of the few.
Or the one.
Like:
3
It’s kind of an irony, that your username is Walternate.
Like:
0
My easy hypocritical answer: no, I wouldn’t have done the same as AltBroyles. Hypocritical, because 1. I don’t have kids and 2. If I had them, having them in danger is a huge factor to consider. It’s easy to say no sitting comfortably at home in front of a computer.
Like:
4
I’d have to agree with that as well, because the same goes for me. However, it think it is safe to take into account that as far as Walter goes, Peter was really his son at the time, per se. Broylnate was foolish to trust David Robert Jones, and even more foolish to accept that kind of deal. But it is his son, and if I had a child, I’d probably do anything to protect that child. I also know that Broyles had no idea what Jones was planning, so in all honesty, I can’t blame him for what he did. Especially in retrospect.
But if I had known, I’m afraid to say the lives of 12 billion innocent people outweighs the life of my hypothetical child. I’m sure Broyles would believe the same, no matter the sacrifice he would have to make.
Like:
3
Which is why, when he realized that DRJ wanted to destroy the bridge and bring back the destruction of his universe, Broyles did the only thing he could do: he chose to save the universe, as much as he could.
I wouldn’t want to be him looking into his son’s eyes as the light fades again, though.
Like:
2
I think I could do everything for my daughter. I can’t lie about that. So I don’t know how I’d react in some extreme moment like that. Of course I share the thought that the well-being of the humanity is more important than one person’s alone, but I can’t guarantee that my instinct as a mother would respect this belief.
When you have kids they are your world, so is pretty hard to know what is the right thing to do.
Well-loved. Like:
12
As DRJ noted in a roundabout kind of way, love is an intense motivator. Would I have done what Walter did? It would be easy to say yes because Walter was one of the good guys and had not made a deal with the devil. Walter’s despair clouded his judgment. But in the OT, as September noted, it set off a chain of events that Walter did not see and could not have foreseen. Because the outcome of Walter’s love (and despair) brought about another powerful motivator from Walternate–revenge.
The Alt Broyles from the OT was someone who gave his life to save Olivia and help her cross back over, and hopefully prevent an interdimensional war. This NT version of him was trying to ease his son’s pain. The love and despair that he obviously felt clouded _his_ judgment. We don’t know how Alt Broyles and DRJ met; I am guessing DRJ approached him as part of the plan. Was the bargain was made, the Corrupt Colonel could not turn back. To borrow a line from Tom Hagen in The Godfather, he “owed his Don a service.”
One of the long-abiding principles of Fringe has been that choices have consequences. There is always a choice.
The bottom line: Walter was right. You don’t know what you would do in that situation, and this is a shade of gray in an otherwise black-and-white consideration. It is hard to ask this sort of a question of a parent. Maybe the parents here should weigh-in.
Like:
4
I wouldn’t do, what altBroyles did, because if you destroy the entire universe, then you also kill your son (along with 14 billion people), and it doesn’t matter, if he was cured or not!
Like:
0
No. A single boy is not worth killing thousands. The needs of the many outweigh the needs of the few.
Or the one.
Like:
1
OOPS. Meant that as a reply to the person above. Reposting..
Like:
0
But if this single boy is your son, you don’t think or feel like that
Like:
2
Technically, Peter isn’t Walter’s son.
Like:
0
Actually, that’s not the point. We aren’t talking only about the show anymore, the question is, when IS your son/daughter, what do you do? And are you sure that you can do the right thing? When that single person IS your world, what world do you save? Those are not easy questions, surprises me how simple do you see this issue after all what we saw on Fringe.
And btw, real is just a matter of perception on this show, right?
Like:
5
For me, personally, I cannot answer that question at this point. The idea of me having children is so far out of my mind right now it cannot be overstated. But if I was Broyles, as I stated above in my corrected post, I would likely have done exactly as he did. If I had known that the cost of my son or daughter’s well being would mean the death of 12 billion people, then I would let go of my child. No matter how painful it would be. But as I also stated above, making that decision and judging Broyles or anyone for the choice he made, especially in retrospect, would be unfair. What Walter said to Altlivia at the end of the episode sums it up perfectly. And in the end, Broyles did the right thing by turning himself over.
Real is indeed a matter of perception. As is what is right and what is wrong. But that is a completely different conversation that is completely irrelevant at this point in time.
Like:
1
If he were to choose his son over saving the universe and go ahead with Jones plan wouldnt he then be ultimately killing him anyways when Jones tries to destory both universes?
Like:
1
Indeed.
Like:
1
Yes, but I think that AltBroyles wasn’t aware (consciously) that DRJ wanna destroy both worlds or something so terrible. When he finally sees what his heart was trying to deny, he does the right thing.
Maybe when he signed the deal with the devil, he didn’t consider how high would be the price.
Like:
4
He did say to DRJ, that the machine is healing both worlds, he had to know something.
Like:
0
But as Walter once said;
Family is very important to me, there’s nothing I wouldn’t do.
I think that’s the case with altBroyles, too.
Like:
0
There are no right or wrong answers to this question. It is one of the many philosophical questions raised by Fringe that elevate it above a mere tv show. I think it is important to remember that we never know all the consequences of our choices. Firefly
Like:
2
I think Fringe is all about what is right and wrong, and the perception of those morals/precepts, guiding ideals, however we want to frame them, Fringe has been solidly exploring what it means to make a choice out of love, and it’s the wrong choice. Over and over again we have seen this, in the stand-alones also, as well as the echoes now with Broylnate, with Walter. Walter has blamed himself for making the choice for so long now, because it was the wrong one. So we can hardly talk about Fringe without getting into talking about choices, and right and wrong. That’s partly what makes Fringe so interesting, because it tackles these ideas. I love it! Yaay for a show that thinks!
Like:
3
It is not that simple. Walter did not know what the consequences were of taking Peter to the blueverse when he brought him over to save his life, but he was wrong to keep him to avoid breaking Elizabeth’s heart. My point is that Walter could not have known the consequences as Broyles suggested. We can never go back to an act already done and decide whether it was right after we know the consequences. In part Fringe is about the unknown/unintended. consequences– a la Firefly. How many times do we yearn to know what would have happened if we had made a different choice. Fringe lets us know some of those what ifs via different universes and different timelines.
Like:
4
OK, Spock.
Like:
2
First thought after that episode:
Altlivia looked GOOOOODDD in that cream pea coat thing
Like:
7
Cream ? Grey to my eyes, and yes she looked marvelous.
Like:
6
lol yes i have just seen its grey!
Like:
3
damn she looked smoking
wish we could see her in that more lol
Like:
3
Right?
Like:
3
Hmmmmmmm…
THE PEA COAT!!!
Like:
0
One thing I didn’t understand. How could Diana let DRJ into her home if she never met him before. That man is downright creepy looking. I would have taken one look at that face and ran away screaming. She left him alone with her son, no way.
Loved alt-broyles with Chris. Very touching. Lance Reddick is a fine actor. Unfortunately they don’t give him enough to do.
Miss the Peter/Walter interaction.
Liked red Lincoln blue Lincoln is a dud.
Astrid/alt Astrid very convincing.
Meana
Like:
4
Jacksonheights– I am howling your comment re Diane letting DRJ in!!! Might gave been posing as the doc helping Chris.
Like:
3
Your observation regarding Diane and DRJ is spot on. I had a similar thought. I’ve been with my husband long enough, that if you really are a “friend” then I would have met you, or heard plenty about you. Especially if I’m going to allow you in my home to hang with my kids while you wait for him. Colonel Broyels has a much higher security clearance than my dear husband. So yeah, I had to suspend disbelief for a microsecond there.
(Seriously, I have second and third thoughts about opening the door for the FedEx/UPS person if I don’t recognize them or see the truck.)
Like:
6
I couldn’t get over why she kept the fact that there was someone in the house waiting for him until she was done telling him about his son’s day.
Seems to me the more pressing thing to reveal first.
Like:
5
Lance Reddick is amazing, he rocked this episode. It’s hard for me to accept, that AltBroyles would ever be a traitor or responsible for the deaths of who knows how many people, though. I loved seeing Chris again, so happy and well, and I can understand why AltBroyles would be tempted to give in to DRJ, but to go as far as to actually work for him? That’s harder to swallow, maybe because the AltBroyles I remember was a honorable man with a will of steel and he would have tried to find another way.
I loved that the Astrids met again. I want a spin-off of those two together fighting crime with equal parts of adorableness and badassery.
It was fun to see Walter on the other side, but I didn’t like that they used him to take the easy way out:
Walter: The mole is Broyles.
Fauxlivia: Damn! You are a genius!
Good thing Walter was there, because all of their technology and investigation skills are nothing compared to a good old cop-out.
Lincoln is such a creep!
So Jones is planning to collapse the universes into one and I suppose he has chosen a safe spot for himself and his minions. I hope he has thought of everything, the most important thing being tea plants. How else would he ever enjoy a cup of his favorite beverage?
Like:
6
If you think carefully, AltBroyles, in the old timeline, risked the certain of have a possible weapon to defend his world (our Olivia or at least her brain studied) to help a single person, one that he didn’t know for sure if she will honor her promise, if she was really trustful. He betrayed his country. I know it’s not the same, but it shows that sometimes he puts the well-being of one single person above the greater good.
I think I’m just really enjoying the fact that he wasn’t a shapeshifter or an evil villain without layers.
About Jones, I think that’s why he was training in Westfield, he was looking for a way to create some stable place to hide when he get that party started.
Like:
4
I like to think that AltBroyles didn’t betray his world for a single person in S3, although that’s what appearances say. He didn’t have any particular love for Olivia and, other than some sadness, I don’t think he would have suffered much if Olivia had been killed. He was grateful to her for saving his son and that gave her credibility to sell her way out with that speech about saving both universes. He betrayed his world in the hopes of saving it (along our universe).
Like:
2
And Lincoln is just creepy. Why he exists? I think that his presence should be really disturbing for Altlivia, like if he is trying to replace the other Lincoln for her. And it was weird to see Altlivia investigating without a team, just with blue Lincoln, seems like he goes to every government division and start to work immediately with high clearance and filling spaces when experienced agents would be more reasonable to do it.
Well-loved. Like:
12
Maybe lincoln has just got one of those “We can trust him with our universe” kind of faces.
Like:
6
I am really worried about the Alt-Fringe team. Charlie has probably been eaten by Bug Girl (maybe she is MANTIS?) and nobody has replaced him. AltLincoln died and no one from that division has stepped in (he needed to die to make space for Lincoln and make him relevant, though). Will anyone replace AltBroyles? Don’t they have more qualified agents?
Like:
4
The same has to be said of our side. The fringe division over here was so desperate that they had to include a guy who uncovered there super secret operation using a license plate!
Like:
4
You are right, but you have to admit that for an elite super-team of heroes (as they are considered over there), the Alt-Team is surprisingly scarce, even compared to the one over here.
You know who would make a great addition to the team? Agent Tim. I like him and something tells me he wouldn’t be so useless and melodramatic (OMG! LET ME LOVE AN OLIVIA, ANY OLIVIA, PLEASEPLEASEPLEASE!). If there is a S5, make it happen, writers!
Like:
6
I think that our Lincoln will replace AltBroyles. He was already in the table that decided the fate of the universes in Enemy of my Enemy, what is to be the head of the Fringe Division?
Peter already called him boss one time, maybe it’s a sign.
Like:
6
Unacceptable. Like her or hate her, that should be Fauxlivia’s new position not Lincoln’s, who has only been a few months in the regular Fringe division and who isn’t even part of that universe. I don’t want to accuse the writers of misogyny.
Well-loved. Like:
19
This. Normally it would go to alt-Lincoln, but since he’s dead Fauxlivia is next in succession.
Like:
1
I said that in a comment above ,that I thought it should go to AltLiv, not Lincoln. He hasn’t been there that long! Do they have any other agents there?
I like all the points raised here about Lincoln…..the strangest one for me, is that he looks just like Agent Lee who just died, and none of the other officers are saying, “hey, you look familiar!” Even his Show-Me card has the same name! Maybe all the Fringe agents over there need some of AltAstrid’s imported coffee.
Like:
1
Lincoln exists for the mere reason that anyone on TV exists: Someone thought it was a good idea. But that is only part of the equation. The other half is the person who hears an idea and says, “HEY!!!!!!!”
Purple Lincoln is now, unfortunately for the show, a cliche of a caricature of a parody of a…well, you get it. Right now, this character adds nothing to the show. But we have been warned. At the end of the episode, when he was at The Bridge with Fauxlivia, he said he wasn’t going anywhere. Which means, we will have MORE LINCOLN!
Hot debate. What do you think?
8
Yes Lincoln, just stay there and let Jones kill you! Don’t move!
Like:
1
“I loved that the Astrids met again. I want a spin-off of those two together fighting crime with equal parts of adorableness and badassery.”
This. I would pay good money to see this.
Like:
1
and my fringie of the week goes to…………FAUXLIVIA.
She was awesome again in this episode and frankly shes edging blue olivia at the moment in my mind, when shes not being annoying sassy shes a damn good character, liked her scene with walter a lot, all though some of her lines didnt land well with me, it was still very good.
JASIKA was in the episode and she had a scene with her double, very pleasing got another chance to shine and she should be in it more. Lance reddick was actually in a fringe episode for more than 5 minutes, so obviously as a die hard broyles fan (both versions) i was ecstatic. I liked the explanation as to why he was helping jones and it made me respect the character more when he gave himself up, although i wish they would have expanded the confession scene a bit more so the two broyles could interact, i just felt that they stood looked at each other and then they took altbroyles back to the altverse, felt a bit odd.
Not a lot of screentime for peter and ourolivia in the last few episodes and from the look of next weeks promo thats not gonna change till atleast 4.20 shame, although i admit walter teasing peter was a bit cringeworthy.
Lincoln…….was there.
Well-loved. Like:
10
“Not a lot of screentime for peter”
A case of “real life writing the plot’, I suspect. J. Jackson had a chance to go to South Africa to film a movie, and his role in the last 2 episodes was reduced to accomodate his schedule.
Like:
4
I agree with you on the confession scene. Also, Lincoln and Olivia were 10 minutes behind, so apparently Alt Broyles and our Broyles talked for a good ten minutes! Would have been an amazing scene, damn the 40 minute time limit
Like:
2
Shenanigans! There I said it…
What? No, Charlie Francis! At the time this episode was shot the writers and producers didn’t know what the show’s fate would be. So you mean to tell me with the fate of the show pending we couldn’t get a flash of Charlie at the funeral?
No Walternate? What? Did they need to recycle his office furniture to use in Broyles(nates) office? Season 3 everything went through Walternate, now, next to nothing.
Though I have thoroughly enjoyed many of this season’s episodes, I can’t shake the need to “blame” the S4 drag on Lincoln. Why was it necessary to add Lincoln as a regular (filler) character? Did his presence on the team over here really have that much of an impact?
It’s trivial sure, but it struck me as odd that Alt-Lincoln dies, and bam(!) Lincoln steps in as her partner and that’s kosher. Leveraging the audiences established history with Charlie’s character last season was a smart move, IMO. Yet, it’s felt like we’ve been burning episodes trying to make Lincoln happen. You know who would have been on to Broylesnate before tonight? The same person that knew something was up with ‘Olivia’ last season (That’s right, Charlie.). Not only that, but I can’t abide by the notion that Lincoln is “Fringe enough” for Over There to substitute for both Alt-Lincoln AND Charlie! The storyline with Broylesnate’s deception just came to an abrupt stop. Who’s to say that less Lincoln wouldn’t have freed up time for more Broylesnate/Broyles story?
[i already know Kirk Acevedo was on another show thus unavailable, but that was last year. That show was swiftly canceled, and for good reason (unlike Fringe).]
What worked for me tonight:
The way Walter has gradually moved from coming to terms with Peter’s existence to fully realizing and accepting Peter as a “real boy” and as his son. You could look at Walter’s references to Peter and Olivia’s quality time as awkward, but that to me was more evidence of [Our] Walter. Face it, Walter has always been a P/O shipper!
I enjoyed Walter and AltLivia’s scenes together as well. I imagine they probably worked as well together while she was undercover Over Here too (in this timeline).
Hot debate. What do you think?
9
The two relationships i have missed most this season:
- Walter and Peter (which is back in name only IMO)
- A Charlie with A Olivia (they had so much chemistry and it was so obviously never romantic. Just a great partnership)
Well-loved. Like:
10
Im curious about what you think about this guys. If Kirk Acevedo was avaliable and not filming that show he was in (thats now cancelled) when they were about to do season 4. Would he be a regular instead of Seth Gabel?
Like:
3
There were a few Pre-Season 4 interviews with Kirk Acevedo and the Fringe Producers discussing some scheduling in some Charlie Francis face time this season. What happened?
Talk about pulling a “White Tulip”. I watched his other show (which is a shame they didn’t get right, out of respect for the original, which I enjoyed) and just kept imagining posts about it’s inevitable demise. I now know that I should have focused my energy on imagining Kirk Acevedo on a plane to Vancover, on the set of Fringe, filming scenes for Season 4.
What I want to know is whose pant’s adjustment is to blame for more Lincoln and no Charlie? Oh hell, just Lincoln period? It is clear the show has been on a tight budget, and a short leash. I want to know why was there not more Nina, Astrid, Broyles, and DRJ bang for their collective buck! Show me the receipts!
Like:
5
” Would he be a regular instead of Seth Gabel?…”
I don’t know the reasons behind decision to put SG instead KA, but I personally prefer KA just because Olivia/Charlie had great chemistry which is evidently showed through great partnership, without any romantical feeling. This whole Linc/Peter/Olivia triangle left bad taste in my mouth. So unnecessary diversion…
Like:
5
I think it would still be Seth Gabel.
Because:
1.) They love romance and there was no way they could do a Charlie/Olivia/Peter triangle or Charlie/AltLivia.
2.) They love young girls and young girls prefer boy band looking actors.
Like:
3
Three words: LONGEST. HONEYMOON. EVER.
Kirk was just awesome, we need him back. I remember him saying he had a minor role this season. Hopefully it will be in the next few because there are only four left.
Like:
7
Maybe they are having their honeymoon in amber.
Like:
1
I’m telling you, Bug Girl is Mantis and she ate Charlie during their honeymoon. The AltTeam was too embarrassed about it, to acknowledge it ever happened.
Like:
6
How can I write a love letter to you, Altivia ? What’s the address of the bridge ?
Like:
7
Statue of Liberty National Monument, Liberty Island, NY, NY 10004
Hot debate. What do you think?
8
Tell me where have you been, Walternate! I was waiting to see you during the entire episode and nothing!
Like:
3
Well, it seems no one decided to tell me that the leader of Fringe Division was coming to my place of work to sabotage the machine. So I was actually up in my office playing with my Shapeshifter Shocker.
Like:
6
PLEASE THIS IS A MESSAGE FROM THE OTHER SIDE: WE NEED SOME LINKS TO WATCH “THE CONSULTANT” FREE WATCH ONLINE.
Like:
1
Buy it on iTunes!
Like:
1
http:// www. vureel. com /video/ 40996 /fringe- s04e18
Like:
0
just watched it on there so i know it works
But take out the spaces cos it wouldnt let me post it otherwise:)
Like:
0
No offense, but I don’t really understand why you would post that here. The show is struggling, and while a decision may have already been reached, everything helps. There are perfectly legal ways to obtain the show while supporting it monetarily at the same time. The show is available on iTunes for $2.99. Why not just buy it?
Like:
1
no offense taken,
The reason i posted that here is because they asked
the reason i don’t buy on itunes is (and i have just searched) you can’t get it on itunes
Plus i don’t see the point of paying for something that you can get for free, espesially when i am trying to save up to buy a keyboard And its not as if i am not gonna watch it on the channel that we pay for, its just that it the uk it airs almost a week later and i am just an impatient person who gets bored pretty easy and has internet access
Like:
4
What is wrong with you? Don’t pirate.
Like:
0
This episode did nothing for me… there, I said it.
I didn’t feel anything, for anyone. Maybe it’s me, (probably), but by now all characters feels unknown to me, because in some way there are NEW, and only Peter was known variable, and he is “sharing his time” with Olivia (who isn’t really OurOlivia, but she’s closest we’ll get) ergo I didn’t have “emotional bridge” to anyone particular.
I don’t feel Lincoln, you’re all right: he is creepy in one way, and so unnecessary character in other way. So much time wasted on him, and Charlie is missed dearly.
I already stated my opinion on Bolivia (writers destroyed her character development by reseting whole universe IMO, and now trying give her some “develop” by killing her partner, but, it didn’t work for me). Yeah, I just.. don’t feel it.
And one remark: writers don’t know how to write P/O relationship anymore, and by reading JJ interview, apparently also Walter/Peter relationship, because – remember ‘aaaw” hug in the scene when Walter shows Peter his “miss birthday presents”? Well, according to him, it wasn’t scripted. JJ and JN decide to add hug. What is happening to writers? One of main reason I stick with this show is my emotional investment to W/P, and P/O, and yes, Fringe is more “family drama” then SF element to me.
That was my opinion form the “emotional investment ” point of view…
As for the main story, finally some movement, but it’s also felt flat, especially the end. I don’t know, this episode was weak for me.
I really look forward to famous 19. episode, Observers are so BIG part of Fringe, so any episode connected to them is big one in my book.
Well-loved. Like:
12
It’s not just you, and it’s the worst kind of thing to experience when watching a television programme.
Like:
6
I’m having a problem with knowing what happened to the original universe of the first three seasons – I know it’s been ‘reset’, but in my mind, it still exists ,and we are watching another version of that universe. What has been fun is watching how Walter and Olivia have become more like themselves (from that original universe we know) but no one else is. Is Peter’s presence affecting the world, or not? If so, why isn’t everyone changing to their original selves?
Other than this, I have had trouble connecting with what character to cheer for, other than Peter – you put it really well, Liz. And yet, I love Fringe so much that I’ve stuck with it, and there have been some really great moments and creepy monster stories again to tide me over while Peter discovered he was already home….it just bugs me that this world didn’t reset itself as a whole, that Olivia had to let go of her previous memories to take in someone else….which is weird….but no one else had to. Then again, time travel and alternate history tends to do this to me anyway.
I LOVE seeing all the variations of the characters, the different mutations of their lives in the timelines, and I love the recurring themes, etc. I do wish we had a little less Linc, and more of Peter and Olivia because they are the stars! And the team that is Fringe, for me. It’s been an interesting season, and some of the stories have been so good, especially when dealing with DRJ. Happy he’s back, wish we could have one mention of ZFT, do they exist on this timeline/world, whatever?
Like:
3
I love the fact that the writers didn’t go for a shapeshifter AltBroyles, but a sympathetic figure who sacrificed for his son.
And all the love for drunk AltLivia!!
Well-loved. Like:
11
For me, this episode had pacing issues and some really awkward dialogue (Walter’s Santa Claus line both came out of nowhere and went completely unnoticed). It was okay, but not the episode I was expecting.
And I really couldn’t wrap my mind around how Linc and Altliv managed to discover where Broyles was and get all the way from the division headquarters to Liberty Island in the exact same amount of time it took Broyles to walk down the hall and enter the elevator.
Like:
5
I think Alt Broyles took 10 minutes to confess to our Broyles while AltLiv and Lincoln were running there, it was an awkward scene
Like:
1
Re-checked it and he is in the elevator at the same time as they run pass the security guy checking the showme cards
Like:
2
Loved Altivia!, my Fringie also. Altivia and Walter make some of the best funny, tender emotional scenes happen in the spot without even trying.
I knew Broyles was being either blackmailed or family member kidnapped, so it wasn’t a surprise for me that he wasn’t a SS. But I think it’s somewhat unacceptable that there wasn’t any reaction from the Secretary of Defense. There has being a lot going on (Captain Lee, Nina, Broyles) and Walternate is nowhere near the case of Jones?…that didn’t add (Unless he is also missing, kidnapped or replaced by SS? – this could fix the Peter-Walter dilemma of whom to choose at the end, wouldn’t it?). At the end, I liked how Broyles didn’t hesitated to turn himself in, not even when Walter gave him an easy excuse to continue with his betrayal.
It was great to see Walter’s brilliant theories, I’ve been missing him as a genius scientists, though I wanted to believe he was a changed man, and more aware of the consequences of crossing over…so I’m not comfortable with him doubting AGAIN about a selfish choice. It has already been settled earlier in the season, and now the issue is back?.
I think I enjoyed more last week episode, but Fringe makes great TV stuff all the time!!! and my night was complete with Anna, John and Lance scenes…they delivered greatly.
Tomorrow the re-watch of course.
Well-loved. Like:
10
Won’t say I was really “shocked” by the big reveal at the end of the episode, I mean even if it wasn’t expected before the episode aired, it was easily figured out from the hints the episode kept dropping. That said, I still felt it was a fantastic episode that moved the DRJ plot along in extremely necessary fashion (and this is coming from a POlivia shipper). I’m glad to see the show get back into what Jones is up to, it definitely needed to be addressed and they did it in grand fashion with this episode.
Also this episode featured 3 of probably my favorite intimate character side moments that I’ve seen in the show…they may have not progressed the storyline too much but they were a perfect example of what makes this show so brilliant in my opinion:
1.) The scene with the 2 Astrids. It brought tears to my eyes. It was such a randomly sweet and touching moment between two characters that really never get to interact. And you add to that, that we really never see an emotional side of Altstrid and that made it all the better.
2.) The Bolivia/Walter scenes…all of them, like in Making Angels, were fantastic! I have entirely grown to love Bolivia in this timeline considering she doesn’t have the lingering Peter connections with her character, I can just completely enjoy her charismatic and charming swagger. And I think her scenes with Walter cut through that bravado and show the very human and vulnerable side she hides, as was evidenced in the scene with Walter making eggs and her resting her head on his shoulder…it was a very sweet scene which I think fits nicely with his previous sweet scene with Olivia when he thanks her for trusting him to go over to the other side.
3.) I thought the Broyles/Alt-Broyles “I got your message” scene was FAN-TAS-TIC. At first I was worried even Over Here Broyles was a mole too and then I saw that Alt-Broyles turned himself in and I once again, for the ump-teenth time in Fringe history, had to praise the writers for taking a seemingly blatant traitor/villain and making them into an entirely sympathetic character put into a horrible situation.
…This show just makes it work on so many levels. The fact that after 4 seasons I continue to be amazed at the emotions they can evoke out of me from what seems to be such obscure plots is exactly why this show needs to stay on the air.
Well-loved. Like:
11
“…This show just makes it work on so many levels. The fact that after 4 seasons I continue to be amazed at the emotions they can evoke out of me from what seems to be such obscure plots is exactly why this show needs to stay on the air.”
I agree with you 100% on this, and I think this is why more people don’t watch Fringe. Nothing is ever cut and dry, and there are never any easy answer. After you watch an episode, aside from trying to come up with a theory about the plot, you have to grapple with the very human emotions that come up and wonder about the choices the characters made. Most shows just don’t provoke that kind of thought, and I think most people want an easy out.
Like:
4
I agree with both of you, excellent points about Fringe. And I’d quote the quote you do, shidey17, except you already did! lol Wonderful way to put it.
Like:
1
It was the season’s best episode for me.
Many great things.
Have we missed Walternate’s funeral?
Like:
7
Hands down, Lance Riddick was the best thing in this episode. What I am wondering is, why is blue Lincoln suddenly wearing his hair like red Lincolns? What is he up to???
Like:
3
Unconsious transference is a possibility.
Like:
3
* unconscious *
Like:
1
For some reason the image of the two olivias having a drinking contest just popped into my head and now i think it needs to happen. Ourliv would totally own that sh*t!!
Well-loved. Like:
11
yeah would love to see that, but some how i think the dunhamnator would kick altlivs ass in a drinking comp, she sure loves her late night bourbon’s.
Like:
6
Yes. Except poor Altliv would be on the floor after one or two drinks apparently. Not that I wouldn’t pay to watch the two of them just sit and breathe.
Like:
6
I miss Scotch Dunham!, she owns that contest and my favorite image is when she’s at the bar and one observer left her the machine’s drawing…HER FACE!…and then she went for coffee to meet Walter…lol
Like:
5
If I’m not mistaken, it was revealed in the last episode “Everything in the right place” that both Lincolns moved with their dads after their moms passed away. Now who was the blonde lady that said “no child should die before his parent” at AltLinc’s funeral? She seemed tremendously heartbroken! Was it just me or this was actually awkward?
Like:
5
Yes, I saw that too and it was weird. As Batman, we already saw mention to him over there (at the apartment that Walternate gives to Peter, the comic book. And at the theater outdoor, something like “Batman vs. Indiana Jones). I don’t understand how Peter could influence the absence of Batman in the new timeline or how Lincoln’s father is not a judge anymore in this timeline.
Like:
1
September’s personal preference?
Like:
2
I’m so glad that I’m not the only one these weird continuity errors bother. I can understand maybe that the writers forgot about Lincoln’s dad the judge because it was mentioned at the end of season 2, but I’m having trouble figuring out how you can tell us someone is dead in one episode and then in the very next one, she is somehow alive again. In order to keep some sanity about me, I’m going with the idea that she is an overly attached step-mom.
Like:
1
Why can’t a step-mom love her child ?_?
Like:
1
some people have very loving relationships with their step parents.
Like:
0
There was supposed to be a brother also…I don’t think Peter’s absence reached out that much, did he?
“Amber 31422″
LINCOLN LEE: And all this time I thought my brother was a pain in the ass
Like:
1
There’s nothing in this episode that I didn’t appreciate.
Starting from the first scene, I knew I’d like it. Honestly, I love the stance they’ve given Alt-Livia since the prior episode. I’m enjoying seeing this her, the one without all the burdens created at the end of last season. Her spunk is infectious, and her determination and stubbornness is definitely a trait shared with our Liv, and I love it.
The scene between her and Walter was priceless. Given EVERYTHING that happened to them last year, and the animosity Walter showed her at the beginning of the season, that scene swelled my heart so big, it almost popped. Not only was it well written with comical aspects, but showed the progression of a relationship that was once rather hostile, in Walter’s perspective.
I think one of my favorite things, was Olivia’s genuine concern for her doppelganger when talking to Lincoln. It showed us that not only had Walter warmed up to the red-headed spitfire, but the Dunhamator has found it in her heart to forgive the assault committed by her other. It’s an interesting improvement too, because this Olivia now, is no longer just earlier season four Olivia, but the Olivia of seasons past as well. Meaning, the reprehensible middle created a season past, has been well looked over in the eyes of our Original Dunham, and replaced, simply, with empathy. I liked that aspect a lot. If this is the only hint ever, that I’ll get of an amiable reunion between the two, then I’m taking it. I always wanted to see them play, civilly and comfortably, in the same sandbox. And given, that technically, in this timeline, Fauxlivia never found Peter’s Boom-Boom, I suppose here is as good place for Olivia to finally accept her alternate as a less emotionally damaged kindred spirit. Kudos to you BlueLiv.
Personally, I didn’t mind Walter’s ‘My son and his girlfriend’ comment outside at the crime scene. To me, it felt less like a directive toward Peter and Olivia’s outside-of-work antics, but toward Walter’s acceptance of his son, and therefore the more personal aspects of his life. Obviously, we found out which house is frequented more in the ‘your house or mine?’ question asked earlier this season, and quite frankly, that we got the answer to that was also comical, IMO. I mean, finding Peter there once already post 4×15 was clue, hearing he’s left his toothbrush there, well, that makes me assume it doesn’t get nearly as cold at Liv’s place.
On top of that, the lovebird comment did make me squawk lovingly as well. I think I ended that scene with an ‘oh, Walter, we know what they’re doing. They’ve been sparsely apparent for the last three episodes! Haha, you’re so funny thinking we couldn’t figure it out!’ And I meant that with all the love a shipper heart could ponder, of course. I think really, it just added to my appreciation of Walter’s new affection for his adult son and the happiness he wants him to have. Again, here, in this timeline, all the resentfulness and hatred that once colored Peter’s view of his father has been completely wiped away, leaving Walter oblivious to all the things that big boy Peter wasn’t proud of. None of that ugly middle matters anymore, yet the matured, closer knit impact it had on the relationship between father and son remains. I kinda like that. Alot like.
Honestly, I like the fact that lately, Petey and Olive are together, undercover…literally. It gives us more time to focus on things like Broyles! and DRJ, and Over There and Meana, and all of those things that are making this a tip-top end of the season. I know alot of shippers who’ve been frustrated with the lack of Polivia in the last three eps, but quite frankly, think it was kinda staring us in the face in this one, if not as intimately as some would have liked, but blatantly none-the-less. Still cute, still there, just not dominating, and I like knowing that out there, Peter and Olivia are having grand empty-lab sex while I get to see Alt-Livia get drunk on my screen, cause the latter part I’ve never seen before, and enjoyed it immensely. The former…well, my imagination takes care of that just fine.
Do I even have to mention here how awesome Broyle’s part was in this episode? I mean oh my god, kill me now, Lance, you devil, you killed it! And I knew, in my heart of Philip loving hearts, that he had a good reason for being bad, and this proved it. And how satisfying it was for me, someone who loves the big ‘L’ concept, to understand that it’s another father’s love for his son that could have potentially opened another fissure that would have yet again broken worlds. Of the whole episode, the scene between Broyles and his son stole my heart. I love seeing this side of my favorite stern boss-man, and I left that scene with an ‘aww’ moment, knowing, subconsciously, that he would end up doing the right thing. And he did. *sigh*
And the Walter/Broyle’s moment, priceless. I think Walter’s comment made us realize, if we hadn’t known already, how deeply he’s grown to care for his out-of-nowhere son, and how he’s chosen to do as Alt-Astrid suggested in Making Angels, and love him and be happy. To which I came to the conclusion, that it’s not simply recreational drugs that can explain Walter’s chipper mood lately, but his willingness to surrcomb to the emotional effects of daddy-love. As if we didn’t glean that from NAIS already…lol.
I know too, that I may be in the minority for even mentioning the name, and god forbid the concept, but having Lincoln toy around in the Alt-verse is making me actually like him. There, I said it, haters hate. I’m actually finding him to be a lot less of a pain-to-the-subsequent-storyline-ass, and more of an actual character that I can, if I contract hard enough, relate to. I may even be excited to see what his future holds in Alt-Liv’s world, and how it will *actually* progress his character. I feel like if he’s to ripen at all, it’s there, tinkering around with finding himself and all those really, really cool technological advances.
Long post relatively shorter, I thought this episode was sublime.
Well-loved. Like:
19
“haters hate”
And i do…i do….
Like:
3
Rae, I don’t know if I’m quite where you are on the Lincoln front, but I’m also not going to hate on you.
There is potential for his character and maybe in a season five they’ll be able to develop him more; as long as it’s not at the expense of our original crew.
I also agree with all of the moments in the episode that you pointed out as wonderful.
As always, I don’t really need to add a comment as your’s usually covers my viewpoint as well.
Like:
4
Great post.
I agree about Walter and Peter.
It is kinda wierd that technically Walter isn’t the same as he was in the first 3 seasons, but I think Peter’s presence is changing him. To some that is not good enough, but for me, I am buying it.
Walter has most if not all of the same qualities as in the previous timeline, accept that he has been paying for his mistake(s) ever since he made it. Also, He did not fall into temptation by accepting Peter as his “son.” In many ways he is a better version of himself.
Peter has lived through the previous timeline, and was yo-yoing on his feelings toward Walter for many years. When he showed up at the beginning of the seeason, he expected Walter to help him; when Walter refused, I believe Peter gained more respect for him and an odd admiration.
They are now both in a place where they can accept each other. Walter doesn’t have the baggage of Peter’s childhood, in which Peter started to deeply resent him. Walter (understanding the timline shift) is just happy to have Peter in his life.
While even though Peter has lived through the previous timeline, he was in a good place with Walter at the end of season 3. Now knowing that this Walter is in fact the same Walter, Peter is willing to treat him as such. However, there are subtle differences in Walter that make him a better person. I think Peter has come to love “this” Walter the same if not more, because of those subtlies. (As evidenced by last episode with the b-day presents, which could not have happened in the previous timeline).
Long post short: They are both on the same page, where they want each other in their lives. Just being around each other is affecting the other in a way that I can buy that they are the same Walter/Peter that I have watched for 3 seasons.
Like:
6
I didn’t feel anything during this episode. The pacing was odd, the dialogue, awkward and unnecessary. A few things just drove me crazy — Diane not telling Broyles that there is a mysterious “friend” with creepy scars sitting alone in a room with the son they’re so protective over until after she’s filled him in on said son’s day, and how Fauxlivia and Lincoln got to the Bridge just seconds after Colonel Broyles got there… um, what… ?
I did enjoy to find that Colonel Broyles was not a shapeshifter, and to understand why he was working for Jones. Jones’ plan to “collapse the multiverse” interests me, but I’m also confused as to exactly what that means. I’m looking forward to finding out.
I’m excited for “Letters Of Transit”, and for the final episodes. I just hope they don’t disappoint me, and that if Fringe will end after this season, the ending is a great one.
Like:
5
I thought the episode was OK. I see where you coming from on your points, and the first big comment i posted for this episode was praising fauxlivia, and having now rewatched her drunken scene a few times, i actually dont think its acted very well, its something the way she says her lines, maybe its her accent i dont know but it sounds off….in some way
Like:
6
I thought this too. I loved the scene, but it seemed to me like she wasn’t playing drunk quite right. You’re right that something about it was “off.”
Like:
5
sometimes she seemed to be on drugs, not just drunk
Like:
3
So, is there only one machine in this timeline, or have they been merged when the bridge was made?
Like:
2
I think they have been merged
Like:
4
Just gotta say I think Blair Brown is made of awesome. I just rewatched that first scene with her and Fauxlivia. Even her speech patterns are slightly different – she leaves some endings off words in a way that OurNina is just simply too refined to do. She is a-mazing.
Like:
6
Question:
When Jones is sitting on the bench talking to the guy with the briefcase, he mentions drinking tea and then says something like: “…….. is one of the things I’m really going to miss.”
Does anybody know what he said? I was thinking maybe it was just a certain type of tea or something – or maybe it’s something more significant…
Like:
0
I understood “mucha” I guess it is in fact a type of tea
Like:
0
oh i thought he said mocha
i think its a type of coffee
Like:
0
considering jones is a tea-guy it was most likely …tea!
Like:
0
yeah probably
im a tea person too but i only ever have bog standard,cheapest-of-cheap tea bags so i dont know about any fancy types
Like:
1
As long as you don’t buy the cheapest-of-cheap keyboards. Lol !
Like:
0
lol yeah
I already have one of those so i want a nicer one
But you are talking to the person who glued their 5 year old phone back together 3 times before giving up on it (and that was only because i got glue stuck under the keys so they didnt work)
Like:
1
Am I the only one who thought that guy on the bench was Jones’ son?
Like:
1
Matcha – a Japanese green tea made from a powder. It is lovely.
Like:
3
Hey!! You’ve solved the mystery of the tea
Jones has a really weird voice
Like:
1
The pitch in his voice, sounds funny, like fun to breathe in helium from a balloon funny.
Like:
0
Yeah he’s got a posh accent but the pitch goes all over the place weirdly and he puts weird spaces and emphasis on the words while sounding like he has a sore throat
Like:
1
Ecstaticly brilliant! For episodes like this, i wish Fringe would never ever ever ever end! I can´t even point to any particular moment of the episode which was better than the other; it was full of great walterisms, great character dynamic, awesome acting chemistry, and super advancing plot elements.
I´ll only say: thank you, producers, for giving us such a wonderful story.
Like:
4
I’m glad Colonel Broyles wasn’t really a bad guy. I knew Christopher had something to do with it. Thinking over the possibilities, that was really the only one that was true to what we know about the Colonel. Just another example of complex father-child relations on this show…
The last piece of the Jones puzzle fell into place tonight. I think I’ve figured out what’s going on… and where we’re going. Buckle up, Fringies; we’re going down the rabbit-hole:
On The Mentalist, there is a recurring plotline involving a serial killer named Red John. RJ (as I’ll call him for the rest of the review) has a cult-like following surrounding him, just like this new version of ZFT. He makes unhappy, miserable people feel better about themselves by convincing them he truly cares about them (he doesn’t). Sound familar? Consider what Canaan said about Jones:
“He promised to make me like no one else. I was to be the first of a new breed of human beings.”
Jones also preys on out-of-place people to twist them to suit his own agenda (or rather, someone else’s. More on that below).
But it’s much more than that. He plans to “leave the Island”, so to speak. Just like Lost’s MIB, Jones is a ruthless, charismatic anti-hero in pursuit of an ambiguous goal. The Lost character, I believe, was NOT a bad guy; just in a bad situation. Jones, though we have been conditioned to believe he is, may not be so cut-and-dried. I might not go quite as far as to say Jones is a good guy, but certainly, when you compare the two possible futures: one where Jones fuses the two universes to rule over what remains, and the Observers are a tyrannical regime akin to the Nazis; the Jones one sounds a bit better.
Reading through the ZFT manifesto again, I am now utterly convinced of one thing: The person behind ZFT and Jones is William Bell. He may not be in corporeal form (think how Nina communicated with him in Brown Betty), but he is manipulating Jones for his own ends. I’m thinking it may be a co-dependent relationship in which neither really likes each other (think Peter Pettigrew and the baby Voldemort in Harry Potter), but they both have to work together so they can both get what they want. I think Bell is the reason Jones was able to reassemble himself.
What does Bell want? Obviously to become physical again, but also to become a god. It all goes back to Stephen King’s The Dark Tower. Bell is the Crimson King, Jones is Flagg, both want to destroy that which holds reality together (the universes) so they are gods to the resultant chaos. Of course, if that happens, Jones will probably betray Bell.
So where are we going in the next 4 episodes? In 4.19, the Observers will step in to prevent Jones from destroying the universe, and establish a dictatorship to prevent anything like that from happening again (probably based on the idea that humans aren’t capable of taking care of themselves). The Fringe team will rebel, just like Casablanca. Maybe they’ll time-travel back to 2012 before they take over.
4.20, the Cortexiphan kids join the fight; and we see Nick Lane again. Probably that’s when Rebecca Mader enters the picture. I haven’t figured out how she fits into this, but I heard a theory that she’s Jones and Meana’s daughter. That’s as good an explanation as any.
4.21 and 4.22, everything I have said will come to a head. It’s hard to theorize to this point, because so much can change to invalidate my theories thus far.
Like:
0
Can somente help me please, I do not remember the answer of the following and coudn’t find anywhere:
- In this new timeline, how does the machine was activated and created the timeline?
- Why Walter was mad at Fauxlivia? I mean, why would she pretend to be Olivia if Olivia didn’t go over there to rescue Peter?
Thanks!
Like:
0
The first question, they didn’t answer, not that I remember. I try to see it as a paradox existing when Peter created the bridge, but this is just me trying to fill the void, maybe they answer it until the finale. I think that the machines have merged and they became a single device now.
To the second question, Altlivia comes to our universe to steal that piece of the machine, the same that she came to do in the original timeline. But since we had no Peter, Walter is the person that felt more deceived by her agenda
Like:
2
Actually I wanted to say “…and create the bridge”. But how was the machine activated since there was no Peter?
But when she came, where was Olivia?
Like:
1
Kidnapped. Mentioned at beginning of S4E01.
Like:
2
There is NO answer to the question about the machine because it IS a paradox, and that’s all. Even the machine itself is a paradox with no trace of origin.
Like:
3
I think Olivia was kidnapped, only this time she was put in a cell without them injecting her with Altivia’s awesomeness haha, JK. That’s Olivia’s middle name.
Then I think she was released two weeks after.
Like:
2
No idea. It’s something that the writers should have immediately addressed.
How was the machine activated? Who created the bridge?
They haven’t even addressed it in their videos, which makes me think one of two things”
1) That they don’t have an answer
or
2) They’re keeping it until the end because they needed time to come up with one
There are other possibilities (I’ll admit), but even if they give an answer now, it’s been nothing but a hindrance to everything on-screen.
Like:
0
good questions. they have yet to be adequately answered by the writers. Olivia’s kidnapping is completely pointless in this new timeline since no one seemed aware of her cortexiphan abilities, which was why walternate kept her alive in the first place. By all established logic he should have just had her killed.
Like:
2
I have to say linking Alt-Broyles’s motivation for helping our Liv get back in Entrada (I believe that was the right episode) and for his helping Jones was very well-done.
Like:
1
Another thing annoyed me about this episode (more on Walter’s behalf).
Before crossing through the bridge, Walter is questioned about all sorts of things in regards to the risk crossing might come with.
What was annoying about the entire thing was the apparent disregard for the fact that Walter was the first person out of the lot of them to cross universes, and I would think that he would know a little more on the subject and dangers than a random soldier.
Like:
0
I think you’re just picking things out of nowhere. It’s like saying that Michael Schumacher shouldn’t have to submit to a driving licence test, just because he is a Formula 1 master champion…lol.
Like:
4
If anything, it would be Walter Bishop telling everyone else about traveling between dimensions.
I just would have liked if there were some acknowledgement of his experience. It’s like telling me, after I’ve just baked a cake, what ingredients to use and how to make it.
Like:
1
Well, he was a Consultant for one day. I agree with you that he should’ve been The Consultant since they got together in the round table, but apparently he was unable to go out until Peter returned :S
Like:
0
(From IGN)
“Did you notice how everyone was saying that the two guys from the alternate universe at the beginning died in an airplane crash when in fact the alternate universe doesn’t have airplanes? They have airships/zepplins instead…”
Wow. I didn’t even pick up on that.
Like:
2
uhm…wow, I didn’t pick that up too…
do we really know that they really have no airplanes or are there just way more zeppelins than airplanes?
Like:
0
There have always been a lot of continuity errors on fringe, from the very beginning of the show, but there have been a lot more recently.
Like:
2
Vice-versa… Didn’t the plane crash happen in the blue universe.
Walter, Lincoln, and Bolivia are in the red universe to examine the bodies .
Like:
0
you may be right! I’m gonna rewatch it now!
Like:
0
nope, the “planecrash” happened in the altverse…
Like:
1
Well which universe did the guys hit the ceiling in then ?
The red ?
Like:
1
I think both blue & red died, just two on an flight in the AU and the other in the ceiling over here.
Like:
1
OK. You are right !
The blue it is, because Peter was there to assist Walter before Walter went over to the red side.
I need a coffee now.
Like:
2
Walter went to investigate the other side’s body, but we know that the crash occurred over there as it was Walter, Lincoln, and Alt-Olivia that discussed getting the blackbox – but because they didn’t have any such thing over there, they used their satellite system (or something along those lines).
Like:
2
Wasn’t Dr. Armand “Bug Guy” in “Immortality” at the airport when Altivia was expecting Frank arrival?
Here in “Differences between worlds” says that zeppelings were prominent, but not the only method of transportation and no mention of any airships instead of airplanes.
“Over There they were still using Zeppelins as a common mode of transport in the 80s, with the Empire State building used as a docking station. (Zeppelins continue to be prominent in modern day alterverse, as per “Over There – Parts 1 & 2″).
Like:
3
The doctor in ‘Immortality’ was in the building simultaneous to Alt-Olivia waiting for Frank to arrive by zeppelin.
The issue is that we’ve only ever been shown the zeppelins when in the red universe, and there has never been mention of any planes before. It’s not impossible that they have both, but there unfortunately isn’t anything that the show has provided (minus last night’s mention of a plane crash) that lends to the idea.
Like:
2
I just re-watched that scene in “Immortality” and yes Frank arrived by zeppelin (BTW, Immortality is one of my least favorite episode-thanks for that, lol).
But I’m re-watching The Consultant and Broyles said to Altivia that a “charter plane crashed killing everyone on board…apparently also their counterparts from the other side”…so it means that it was a private jet charter flight from the company right?. That explains it, also they have to have that kind of thing to fly short distances or with a small number of passengers on a trip.
Like:
2
just read that same comment on ign like five seconds ago and was coming to mention it lol.
Like:
2
lol it was a race
Like:
0
I think their plane travel is slightly less advanced(they dont have blackboxes). maybe they have more than one means of air travel. most likely, planes, though they go fster, are plobably more expensive and “airships” are less expensive so people use them more
Like:
1
Also, remember it was established in “Jacksonville” that 9-11 happened in the AU as well. I don’t think you could have done that with a zeppelin; it would have been a very loooong, graceful attack with plenty of advance notice. (And I’ll have to check the transcript, but I’m pretty certain that Walter asked Merged Guy from the AU what buildings the planes crashed into.)
Like:
2
I think this is not a continuity error….I can’t remember if they ever said that planes don’t exist in the altverse….I think they do, there are just way more zeppelins around
Like:
1
The problem is that the show has never before mentioned or shown any other mode of sky-transport in the alt-universe other than zeppelins.
It’s difficult to really say for sure.
Like:
0
well, if they never said that planes don’t exist over there, then I have no problem with this at all
Like:
4
This is the same argument with religion; neither party, whether for or against, can prove that a divine entity exists or doesn’t exist.
But I like to go with proving that something exists rather than proving that it doesn’t. Therefore, for me, lack of evidence in support of the existence of any means of flight other than the zeppelin means that there are no other means of flight other than the zeppelin.
Occam’s razor, baby!
Like:
0
Wrong
Peter travelled in helicopter in Over There part 2
Like:
0
Maybe in Peter?
Like:
0
I think the thing is that the targets just chartered a small flight, and as it happens airplanes are better for that. If they were flying on one of the big airlines it would probably be on a zeppelin.
Like:
1
And if anyone was just wondering what the heck I was talking about;
Occam’s Razor: “A principle urging one to select among competing hypotheses that which makes the fewest assumptions and thereby offers the simplest explanation of the effect”
Like:
0
Interesting, I thought Alt Broyles is a Shapeshifter from Enemy Of My Enemy. I just couldn’t find another explanation, why he is working for Jones. But that treatment for Christopher makes a lot of sense.
Like:
1
While I understood it, I was actually a little disappointed that he ended up being a good guy. I kind of dug the idea of an evil Broyles…
Like:
0
Is it just me, or does BBM look diferent than in TDWD?
Like:
1