FRINGE: 4.15 A Short Story About Love

fringe-a-short-story

Following the recent shocking revelations and emotional events, Peter weighs his options as the Fringe team investigates a killer targeting love in the all-new “A Short Story About Love.”

Fringe 4.15 "A Short Story About Love" Rating

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  1. shidey17 says

    We all knew that was coming, but it was beautiful anyway. (I’m referring to the scene between Peter and September). :)

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  2. willg says

    Great episode. Loved the story line and the reveal that alot of us already guessed. Now I think we can move on from the love story to great and fringeful things!

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  3. Ben says

    That was such a beautiful scene between Olivia and Nina at the end. Nina was brave and unselfish about it, but you can tell it’s tearing her up to basically be losing her daughter.

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    • Scully8 says

      I agree, the Nina and Olivia scene was beautiful. One thing that I found interesting; Olivia said she wanted a relationship with Nina; in seasons 1-3 Nina always felt an affection for olivia, do u think Nina’s affection for Olivia is a result of this exchange some how? Maybe I’m reaching.

      Enjoyed the episode!!!!

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      • Rae says

        That’s exactly what I was thinking, Scully8, that somehow this season happened first. That would be a totally awesome flustercluck! lol…

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        • wikiaddicted723 says

          Not alone in that thought. I totally theorized that this might somehow be the “original” Timeline. In a weird, fringie way.

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          • Rae says

            I think we may have all started theorizing that when Walter and Peter worked on creating the bio-mechanical interface for the machine. I mean, maybe because they created it in this timeline, it worked in the OT one. Perhaps this timeline, and because of the bio-interface created in it, is why Peter was meant for the machine.

            That theory coming to life…it leaves ALOT more questions then answers. lol….And…I’m probably wrong. Cause so far, the only thing I’ve been right about is the Beacon, and this being the original timeline bled back through. Everything else, since season one, has blown my mind completely. I develop migraines because this show makes me think too much. haha.

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            • shidey17 says

              Since we are all reaching, here’s one that’s way out there, just for fun. Maybe we’ve seen more timelines played out than we think. I would think the blue timeline would have had to have happened before this amber one because they’ve kept their memories. But what if there is another one, in between blue and amber or after blue or after amber that we’ve also seen too. It could be a big time loop with different iterations that would be nearly impossible for us to distinguish between, much like Peter wouldn’t be able to distinguish in this current amber timeline except for the fact that nobody remembered him at first.

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          • says

            I love this theory too. I think they built the biological interface for the Machine with Peter’s DNA for the first time in this timeline.

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            • scully8 says

              Very interesting theory, Shidey17 and Fran, and quite possible as it’s a very fringie notion. It’s also a theory that Rocco has been offering all along. :) I love it!

              Just a fantastic episode, award-worthy acting (always) and incredible show. I so hope we get a season 5.

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        • RedVines says

          Agree with all of you! I think that this timeline is the first an original one! We will see how they will manage to explain that … if we are right!

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  4. Darth Kate says

    I knew this was going to happen…
    So why is she the one with any memories?
    why did it take 15 episodes to get their relationship back exactly where it was at the end of season three?
    Did september plant the beacon in season one knowing that all of this would happen and the other observers would turn on him and he would need a way back?
    Why change the timeline at all?
    If they wanted to bring jones back so bad just introduce an alternate jones rather than screwing around for 15 episodes.
    what is the point of this season?

    also… LIV/LINCOLN 4 EVA TROLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLO!!!!!!

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        • hsa says

          I am curious about your list of great TV series–although I have seen many series over the decades, Fringe is right up there.

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        • DeepRunner says

          C’mon Kate, this was a great episode. Enjoy Fringe for what it is, not what it is not.

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            • mlj102 says

              I can’t believe I’m getting involved in this debate again, but here goes:

              “But Kate is doing just that; responding to Fringe for what it is, not what it is not.”

              But there’s a difference. Kate is responding to Fringe by not enjoying it because it is not what she thinks it should be. DeepRunner is suggesting fans enjoy Fringe for what it is rather than constantly griping over what it is not. But there are some fans that just never seem to be pleased because they have different ideas of where the show should go. What Fringe is — the way the story has developed and been presented this season — is not necessarily bad, just different from what some people would prefer. But because it’s not measuring up to the criteria a certain person has set up for it, that person is never satisfied. Perhaps Fringe will never be good in the way you want it to be, but that doesn’t mean it’s not good in a different way. I think all that DeepRunner and others who are commenting, including myself, are trying to say, is why not accept Fringe for what it is? And if you don’t like it, it might be time to move on because I don’t think it’s going to change.

              (Just a disclaimer before anyone decides that I’m attacking them and telling them they shouldn’t be able to disagree or post comments on the site: all I’m saying is if a person doesn’t like a show for what it is, what’s the point in continuing to watch and then being disappointed and complaining about it? I don’t like Glee, so I don’t watch Glee. It wouldn’t make sense for me to continually watch Glee from week to week, then be all irritated because it’s not the show I think it should be, so I constantly comment (online or in person) about how disappointing it is. You’re welcome to continue watching and continue commenting, but you know what you’re getting in to by doing that, so you shouldn’t be surprised if the show is not what you want it to be or if other people who comment get tired of your constant complaining.)

              That’s all I’m going to say on this matter…

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              • Darth Kate says

                i dont enjoy it because the storytelling has become lazy and repetitive. forgive me for hoping that it should be better.

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                • DeepRunner says

                  Better than…what? This show is about the Big Three (plus the Second Three–Astrid, Broyles, and Nina–sorry Lincoln, you may be “Seven” but to many people here, your presence on the show is “Snake Eyes”), first and foremost. Their work. Their relationships. Their lives.

                  It took Olivia to reach Peter. It took Peter to get Walter out of St. Claire’s. It took Walter to be the concerned father for Peter and father figure for Olivia. It took all three of them to be cohorts. The sci-fi has rarely disappointed, and the various reveals over the course of the series have given us great insight into all the characters, both on this side and Over There.

                  From the Pilot to the epiphany in this week’s episode, Fringe is excellent. The only thing that could be better, maybe, is more Orla Brady appearances, and bringing back Charlie Francis.

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                  • Dylan says

                    Better as in, by Fringe standards, back to its season 2 or season 3 quality (second halves and first halves, respectively). I recently joked “i am become melodrama, the destroyer of shows”, and I stick by it.

                    Fringe used to be strong, now it is melodramatic, over-sensationalized, contradictory, etc.

                    it’s not what I had invested the years prior in.

                    What could be better? A lot of things. What could be worse? As far as I can see, not much.

                    Here is where you and I won’t meet eye to eye. A lot of the things you claim are brilliant, i don’t. All aspects of quality are generally subjective, I guess this will be the same.

                    Agree to disagree on…everything mentioned in your post, but don’t take this to mean anything other than an acknowledgement that we have different opinions – no nastiness lies behind these words.

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                • FJ says

                  How about this? If you’re so disappointed in the show, you have a few options:

                  1. Stop watching, thereby you’ll have nothing to complain about
                  2. Get off ur duff and create something better. Back in the day, Star Trek the Next Generation used to accept unsolicited scripts. People took up the challenge and sent in mind-blowing stuff that is still celebrated to this day. If u think the writing is boring and the scripts lazy, why don’t you find a way to send something in that is better? I know studios don’t accept unsolicited content anymore, but in this social media age, you never know.

                  I view Fringe like a great book, or book series. I love the overall thrust, but there are things I could do without. That does not keep me from enjoying the book and I savor it till the last word.

                  I remember people complaining about lots of sci-fi shows. Often I go back and watch them and realize they were doing things that are 1000x better than most of the dreck on TV now or then.

                  You have every right to complain until you turn blue. But, until YOU’VE put it on the line and created something for others you’ll never know true courage. Fringe is courageous. The show runners dare to ask questions. They dare to do things they know won’t fly with most people. They respect their fans. And, they do what they do even though they know if they took the safe route, they might keep their jobs a little longer. That’s right, for them it’s not just a show, it’s their livelihood.

                  And, if you’ve done great art and been courageous, more power to you. Create and ship again and again till you have more appreciation for others who put it all on the line.

                  Art is rare in this world. Learn to appreciate it. If you don’t too bad.
                  ‘Nuff said.

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                  • Dylan says

                    ….this is an unnecessary post. I thought we were past the whole “if you don’t like it, stop watching” argument (if it can be called such)?

                    we loved Fringe, now out of that past-love we voice our dissatisfaction over the show’s current form. Why should we give up? Why should we be punished for expecting more from a show that we know can deliver more?

                    Think about it.

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                  • Darth Kate says

                    Dylan is absolutely right about the “if you dont like it dont watch it” argument and the “you have no right to criticize because you dont make your own shows” argument is just as asinine.

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                    • Darth Kate says

                      you claim i have a right to my opinion and then sit around and complain about the fact that its different that yours. also calling fringe “art” at this point is hilarious.

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                    • Dylan says

                      @Betty

                      What exactly are you trying to insinuate there?

                      There is more than just Kate and I; we just happen to be the most vocal.

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    • shidey17 says

      So I am guessing she only remembers because she was the “failsafe” Walter referred to in the Season 3 finale. Why she is the failsafe….I have no idea.

      I hope they explore what’s happening to September vis a vis the other Observers. Why is he exiled? Is it permanent?

      Does what September said about the beacon mean that they had locked John Mosley out of the universe in The Arrival? Kind of makes sense to me.

      I kind of feel like this was a good wrapping up of everything that’s been going on. I know you’re probably not satisfied with it, Kate, and it was beginning to wear on me a bit, but I think they worked it into the episode and it wasn’t too in your face. I think the exchanges between Olivia/Nina, Olivia/Walter, and Peter/September were really powerful and the major focus of the episode. I can’t wait to see what is in store for us now that this major plot point has been settled.

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      • willg says

        Agree with everything you said. That is really interesting about John Moseley. I didn’t think about that. That he needed the beacon for similar reasons.

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      • Ben says

        I’m curious as to September’s exile as well. At least the other Observers seem to have patched up the bullethole. Srsly, I wasn’t sure he’d make it.

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      • says

        Maybe he just couldn’t come back to the past to play RPG anymore. I think he still can live in the future, just can’t play with the others. When you day traveling on time, you can’t come back or ar banished, IDK…

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        • Darth Simous says

          Well, Kate is not the only one here…many Fringe fans all over the world (me included, to be honest) are not particularly happy with S4, the way it has been presented so far. But let’s hope for the best, besides it is indeed looking up to S5.

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      • onlimain says

        Peter *did* recognize her, but everyone kept telling him he was wrong. Then September showed him the consequences of failing to recognize the correct Olivia the last time (i.e. Henry ceasing to exist), so he started second-guessing himself. At the end of 4×14, Peter never said he no longer sees his Olivia in her eyes; he said he thinks he only sees it because it was what he *wanted* to see.

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      • Ian S. says

        Exactly :) Or perhaps the consequences of Henry living. I theorize we may see the blue intro for that one! [spoiler removed as per non-spoiler thread policy --ed].

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        • shidey17 says

          That’s interesting. That would mean OurLiv had died though, right? If Henry is in his 30s or 40s and the timeline would have stayed the same? Or maybe there’s a reset again? I know we’re not supposed to comment on the unofficial set photos but I think those of you who have seen them may know what I mean.

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    • corazondeazul says

      Lol, Darth Kate, why do you hate Polivia so much? Although I think Josh Jackson secretly agrees with you…but c’mon, man, you had to know this was coming. You’re still watching, so you must enjoy it a little.

      I personally thought that this was the perfect conclusion of the conflict. The only thing that’s upsetting me now is that the Peter/Walter relationship has been basically ignored for half of the season. I will freely admit to being a crazy fangirl, but the only time I have teared up on this show is when Peter called Walter “Dad.”

      The point of this show is the relationships between people…ALL of the relationships, not just the Peter/Olivia one. September said it, and I have enough faith in the Fringe team to think that they won’t neglect it.

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      • Darth Kate says

        i explained why i hate polivia a couple of threads ago i think. the way they rushed it back together by blaming olivia in 6B was horrendous and i cant take it seriously any more. also, they recycled the “will they wont they” arc ad-nauseum to the point where now its just predictable and i dont even care because we know they’re inevitably going to get together. its incredibly lazy of the writers.

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    • Dan S. says

      I’d like to thank my agent, members of the academy, and everyone who has supported me through the years….LOL.
      If you don’t know what I mean, check my prediction on the previous episode’s blog.

      By the way, to the producers of Fringe…I’m available for freelance writer/producer work if you’re hiring.

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    • Dylan says

      Yes, but baby Henry wasn’t the only thing wrong with it all (reference September’s dialogue in ‘The Firefly’). It all began with September distracting Walternate while in the lab – something I have been moaning about all season long; he could have stopped himself from doing that instead of just letting Peter drown.

      And whatever happened to “the boy must live?”

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      • Ian S. says

        I was thinking about that too and it bothers me, but I actually believe there is an explanation to why September didn’t just not distract Walternate in the lab. Maybe September had in mind to eventually bring Peter back, with his memories of blue timeline, because September has a connection with Peter? Maybe he can see how in love he and Olivia are. I think September is just a sweetheart inside ;) But I do expect an answer on that one.

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      • shidey17 says

        Well if September would have gone back and simply stopped himself (providing that’s even an option) we wouldn’t have a show. :)

        I think there are certain things in the timeline that don’t cause such mass corruption that they can be left alone. I’m guessing that the major corruption events have now been taken care of: the universes are not decaying via the bridge, Peter and Olivia are together for whatever purpose they serve, and so on…That’s my bet guess

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        • 134sc says

          My theory is that an observer cannot undo something they have already done. So September could not go back and stop himself. Just like he could not go back and stop himself from saving Peter and Walter at the lake. The only way for that to be rectified, was for Peter to get into the machine.

          But now that Peter is back in the timeline, September thinks that the timeline can now be fixed and Peter and Olivia will have a baby…

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          • Dylan says

            In this new timeline it was established that September did not save Peter from drowning in the lake, but that everything prior to it still happened.

            My argument is that, if September was able to change that action, why could he not have stopped himself from being seen by Walternate?

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      • mlj102 says

        “It all began with September distracting Walternate while in the lab – something I have been moaning about all season long; he could have stopped himself from doing that instead of just letting Peter drown.”

        So say September goes back and stops himself from distracting Walternate. Then what? Walternate has the cure, and he saves Peter. But we have no idea what would have happened after that. Perhaps Walter would continue watching young Peter, alive and well on that side, and he misses his son so much, he still decides to go over and kidnap the other Peter to replace his son. Then we’re still in the same situation we were in before. Or maybe Peter grows up over there and he meets alternate Olivia, they fall in love, and Henry is born. But that’s not the Olivia he was meant to be with and, according to September, Henry’s birth “would have irrevocably altered everything that was to come.” So then what? They still have the same problem. So how would it have solved everything if September simply didn’t distract Walternate from the cure?

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        • Dylan says

          Well, yes.

          September did also highlight the event during ‘The End of All Things’ as the single cause of all this mess, therefore I would imagine that whatever happened afterwards would have been what was meant to happen.

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  5. hsa says

    I just feel so wonderful right now-I do not care if it was predictable or a little cheesey. It was perfect and made my 66 year old heart sing. Thank you Fringe! Never thought the Wizard would be September.

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    • Scully8 says

      Mine too . . . I’m sure the lovers will face challenges, but now they are united to battle what’s aheAd.

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    • Rae says

      Honestly, I didn’t find it cheesy at all. Emotionally evoking, of course, but not overtly sappy.Respectively, I think it would do viewers well to remember, that something may only *seem* cheesy, because we’re not use to seeing these characters being so open with the other.

      It’s just not what we got use to in the first seasons, because their relationships, at this level, were as of yet un-founded. At that time, the main three were just starting to find trust and loyalty in each other, so, as the natural process of evolving relationships, that trust grew to a stronger connection, which, ultimately, brought about different states of interactions. Naturally.

      When I first watched season three, after the Entrada episode, I felt the Olivia and Peter scenes to be a bit awkward, but I figured out, they weren’t at all, it was simply because I wasn’t use to hearing and seeing dialogue between the two in that *context*, in the context of them being *more* then partners, and being in love with each other in this f-ed up reality of theirs. Once I let myself accept that I had to get *use* to this understandably human aspect of how they interact with each other, I liked the two of them, and their scenes together, more and more. Can’t say that I found every piece of dialogue un-awkward or not mis-stated, but as a whole, I found their relationship, and how they were coming to terms with it, believable.

      And you know, watching it back, I really did love it more and more. But…I like the way they’re written this season better. I don’t know if it’s because the actors are singing a different tune, or the writers got more *intune* with who the characters are and how they’ve grown, but whatever the reason. I’m happy about it.

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      • hsa says

        Rae-Do not take my cheesey comment too seriously-I am at heart a romantic. MY grown children chide me about liking “cheesey Fringe.” I always love your analysis. The episode was perfect and, yes, caused me to rethink season 5. Wyman and Pinkner were correct when they intimated we would look back on the previous episodes differently.

        “All there is is love” THE BEATLES

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        • Rae says

          No worries, hsa, I knew how you meant it. :) I’m just so happy that the viewership of this show has such different age ranges, and the audience is comprised of so many different people with so many different experiences, and each person, in their own way, relates and familiarizes with these characters.

          My lil heart implodes on the thought!

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      • scully8 says

        Rae, wonderful comment and nicely said. As a shipper, I just made myself accept their new interaction in season 3–I was hoping for it. However, now, I will go back and re-watch season 3 in the context that you laid out. As always, fan of your musings. :)

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  6. Zakray says

    I avoided spoilers like the plague and I’m so glad I did! It was all a pleasant surprise! Happy, happy, joy, joy! Now let’s get back to Jones and solving the two universes’ problems.
    Loved every moment. Must watch again!

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  7. lizw65 says

    I just realized something…in Season one, in the Blue timeline, Nina was always pushing Olivia to have a relationship, trying to get her to work for Massive Dynamic, and so on. Well, the reason just became clear: Nina remembered the Amber timeline!!! Dunno if that was planned but it’s freaking brilliant.

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    • shidey17 says

      Good point. It will be so tragic if we see her forget Nina onscreen after that great scene between them.

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    • FinChase says

      That’s a very interesting thought! It didn’t occur to me. She did seem to take an unusual interest in Olivia then. Less so later, but I thought that was more for expedience because the writers/producers weren’t giving Blair Brown much screen time.

      Hot debate. What do you think? Thumb up 8

    • Dylan says

      Poor, poor Broyles…totally neglected.

      I did want to give him credit though for looking off in some random direction in the camera footage; away from the crashing table, the disappearing Observers, etc.

      Wonder what he was looking at…

      Hot debate. What do you think? Thumb up 8

          • JM says

            lol. It is sad cause i remember reddick talking about what he wanted to see from broyles this season, his past with the military etc, and he has got less than any other season before, it is pretty ridiculous, i hope lance reddick gets another great job like had in the wire in his career so he can show his acting class.

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            • number six says

              Not a chance. Showing how irresistible Olivia is to men is more important. It’s vital to take up screentime focusing on Lincoln’s constipated face longing for the perfection that is Olivia Dunham.

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  8. Fringee says

    Wow… Pretty weak episode.

    1* I should have learned from last year’s which-Olivia-jumps-first-in-Peter’s-bed-won’t-have-her-universe-screwed storyline that Time Travel, Multiverse theories, and paradoxes are based on Vagendas. And there I was thinking Fringe is doing something new. Now, if Peter and Olivia broke up, we’re all screwed.

    2* Genius way to get rid of nugget and undo the Fauxlivia’s 8 episodes arc from last season.

    3* September believes he can change the world, the way August did, he believes in love and all the emotions humans share. That was the only love related bit that I liked about this whole storyline.

    4* Now that Peter and Olivia kissed and hugged, THE WHOLE UNIVERSE DOESN’T REMEMBER YOU PETER! WALTER INCLUDED!

    5* Okay, assuming….. they all remember and live happily ever after? So potentially, the last 3 years will be just remembered, and never actually happened? Like just in our potagonits minds? … W-were we watching a shared memory after all? I hope I’m wrong.

    6* So, Lincoln, he runs away and pretends all universe savior when AmberOlivia was asking him for dates, and now he has the hots for her and wants her back? Useless character, I hope that beast from Next episode eats him.

    Still love Fringe, just a bit pissed is all.

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    • david says

      That’s exactly true. Lincoln is absolutely a useless character! He is just there to annoy fans!

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      • lost_stef says

        I only agree with the Lincoln part too. I rekon he had to much screen time for my liking this episode. And i couldnt stand his loving glances at Olivia arrggggghhhh She belongs with peter fool, get it through your head!!! :)

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        • Alaina says

          The only way I can look at Lincoln is that every iteration of him is doomed to love Olivia from afar, unrequited and unreciporicated. This is the only way for me not to hate him, instead I kinda feel bad for him…but the longing looks are getting annoying!! It is funny cause I love Alt-Linc.

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  9. willg says

    Check out this tweet exchange with Wyman:

    Sam McPherson‏@mcphersonator
    @JWFRINGE Awesome. Love the s1 callbacks happening this year. One more question: Is September dead or trapped? Or intentionally ambiguous?

    JOEL WYMAN‏@JWFRINGE
    @mcphersonator #WhereYouBelong Hi Sam. September is neither. He found his way back here with Peter’s help. More answers about that to come.

    Interesting

    Like: Thumb up 7

  10. Ian S. says

    This is the first episode of the series I have rated on here a 10/10. It was just absolutely fantastic. The case of the week was so gripping that it didn’t feel “case-of-the-weeky”. Peter’s investigation of September’s home and the Beacon was paced perfectly, as was the story of the burn victim (Michael Massee). The pacing of the entire episode, in fact, was right on. The acting was top notch, and everything led up to the beautiful final scene.

    However, now I’m left to wonder, will some more of the characters remember Peter (most likely Walter, Astrid, maybe even Walternate?) and if so, I’m guessing we will be remaining in this timeline, merged with some of the memories of the old one? That’s very interesting, because in this timeline the stakes are very high with David Robert Jones and his shapeshifters. If that’s the case, I don’t see Jones being completely stopped in the season 4 finale. If this new timeline was supposed to erase Henry/bring back Jones, they’re not going to let him die again unless for extremely good reason.

    Looking forward to the last 7 episodes of the season, especially 4.19 ;)

    ‘A Short Story About Love’ 10/10

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    • scully8 says

      You know, I actually felt a bit sorry for Lincoln. It must be tough living in your own world in which Olivia was falling in love with you . . . NOT.

      I do feel bad for the guy. I do think he’s going to end up with AltLivia. Altlincoln is merely her shoulder to cry on . . . we’ll see.

      Hot debate. What do you think? Thumb up 8

      • number six says

        I also think he will end up with AltLivia. Thus proving that the whole arc last season about the importance of identity was useless and that he Olivias are perfectly swappable. That said, I hope AltLivia has better taste than falling for Lincoln (any of them).

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        • lizw65 says

          My latest theory is that Alt-Lincoln will die somehow (or get shifted) and Over Here-Lincoln will take his place in the AU, thus providing some nice symmetry with Peter, who was born in the redverse but ultimately chose the blue.

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          • scully8 says

            Interesting theory, lizw65. I just hope Lincoln will take on some of AltLincoln’s personality (not that I think he’s that great either).

            Like: Thumb up 2

  11. JM says

    Right it was a great episode, appreciated the answers, even if the music at the end was slightly too “epic”? for my taste. Im also disgusted to say that the moment when i saw broyles was one of the ONLY moments i have seen of him this season :(. An episode that once again didnt benefit from a lot of hype and a long hiatus.

    I had to fast forward the lincoln scenes, i can no longer stand him on my screen. The way he is acted and written now is that he has a deep abiding love for olivia (a woman he barely knows) it would be infinitely more believable if he was a bit gutted cause shes really hot and he had a chance, but then realises shes with some other guy so its ok. But HOW CAN HE BE IN LOVE WITH HER? i dont UNDERSTAND!

    aghhh!

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    • willg says

      I believe you could fall for somebody in the span of several months. I don’t have a problem with that. The problem I have is, when it comes to Olivia, Lincoln becomes obnoxious.

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    • DeepRunner says

      Early this season, Lincoln seemed to be a eunuch when it came to Olivia, now suddenly he’s all pheromonal.

      Not to worry, Lincoln fans…did I just use the plural?…he too will find twue wuv.

      Hot debate. What do you think? Thumb up 8

  12. Fringee says

    Oh, Just wanna add. AmberOlivia copied Our Olivia’s memories and she’s her. than she was Fauxlivia last season when they installed the memories into her too. Makes sense.

    Like: Thumb up 1

    • shidey17 says

      Can you explain this a little further? I’m intrigued but don’t completely get what you’re saying.

      Like: Thumb up 1

  13. elohemstar says

    Does anyone know what was the song the killer was listening to while he had the guy in the tanning machine ?

    Like: Thumb up 0

    • says

      Sounded like Jon Anderson from YES.

      And I thought it was an MRI machine, which could just be me because I have an appt. at 1:15 am for my achilles heel. Time for a sedative.

      Like: Thumb up 2

      • Ben says

        OK, the recapper from the AV Club helpfully pointed out that it was “Friends of Mr Cairo” by Jon & Vangelis.

        Like: Thumb up 0

    • Dan S. says

      Jon Anderson and Vangelis- “The Friends of Mr. Cairo”.
      There are different versions, but this exact one you can find here:

      Like: Thumb up 0

  14. Scott says

    The song was by Jon & Vangelis. It’s called “The friends of Mr. Cairo”.

    I thought this was the worst episode that I’ve seen; too convoluted and cheesy.

    Like: Thumb up 5

  15. DeepRunner says

    F.I.N.A.L.L.Y.

    That was A-FREAKING-MAZING. Great episode. Ended the way it should have.

    The money shots:

    * Peter and Walter in the lab, with Walter telling Peter he (Peter) was a better man than him. Immediately, I thought of the Greek phrase. And the payoff was Peter reciting it. Now that we all know Peter is in the right universe, I expect his relationship with Walter to grow substantially.

    * Peter with September. That was AWESOME. The consequences of September’s intervening for Peter were, evidently, his being locked-out of the Universe by the other Observers. And the payoff was September telling Peter what everyone suspected. Especially about Olivia. He is home, this is his Olivia, and the love that all the Big Three have for each other transcends any effort to dump someone down the memory hole.

    * Olivia with Nina. Good for our Olive. Telling the one person she absolutely trusts in this timeline that her heart was for Peter. Love is greater than what others think. But the producers have left the door open just a crack for things to revert to Amber World by Olivia asking Nina not to give up on her, if the day ever came when she forgets Nina.

    * Peter and Olivia on the street. That WAS the payoff of this eppy. Wyman and Pinkner said it would make shippers swoon. It was the perfect ending to the perfect episode. I am reminded of similar scenes–Navarre and Isabeau in Ladyhawke, Wesley and Buttercup in Princess Bride, Rachel and Ross in Friends…That is some kind of magic and absolute acting chemistry between Joshua Jackson and Anna Torv. Some of Anna Torv’s comments over time have indicated that, of course, it makes sense for Peter and Olivia to be together. And now, barring yet another twist, which of course will most likely happen, Peter and Olivia are together again. In the right place. In the right time.

    * OK, time to throw Lincoln a bone. It was the perfect emblem in the lab with Lincoln tripping over Peter’s stuff. So iconic, and so ironic. He petulant annoyance was understandable, as the guy who will be the best man but never the groom. The guy is a nice guy, and probably had a lot of women tell him in HS and College, “I think of you as a brother.” Lincoln will find love, and who knows, maybe it will Ms. Mader. Or someone. Astrid? I really think it will be Fauxlivia, although I would like them to bring one of the Alias cast over and be a love interest for The Mighty Linc.

    This episode touched on all the points–the relationships, the mythology. This eppy has moved itself into the top five episodes of all time, and has continued the great trend that started with BTWYNB.

    Now, how long until next Friday?

    Well-loved. Like: Thumb up 33

  16. M says

    This episode was awesome but… is the universe still doomed? Did that problem go away or something? I don’t think it’s been mentioned at all since 3.22. It’s pretty important.

    Like: Thumb up 5

    • Ian S. says

      Alternate Broyles briefly stated that universal decay had stopped since the bridging of the two worlds on Liberty Island (ref: ‘Back To Where You’ve Never Been’) so things appear stables right now. In the alternate universe, all problematic areas are ambered and contained, and no new ones can begin now. In our world, decay stopped when we moved the machine to Liberty Island so it was closer in location to the alternate machine.

      Still waiting on the whole answer to “who activated the machine” in this timeline though :\ Who are the ‘first people’ in this universe? That’s what I really want to know.

      Like: Thumb up 3

    • scully8 says

      I read either an interview (or on twitter) with Joel that by creating the bridge is helping to heal the universes — something to do with the energy from the bridge. So basically, just having the bridge is taking care of the decaying universe problem.

      Like: Thumb up 3

      • lizw65 says

        Yep, it was a blink-and-you’ll-miss-it throwaway line earlier this season, but the degradation of the two universes has ceased since the creation of the bridge.

        Like: Thumb up 2

  17. Rae says

    On my scale, that was one of the most stellar-ly acted episodes every. I love how the wrote the Olivia character in it. Despite her emotional upheaval, she still came off extremely determined in processing her reality, which made me appreciate the episode even more.

    Interesting that she would consider the other Olivia a better version of herself, considering of course, that OT Olivia assumed that of Bolivia. But it was nice to understand more deeply, what it is about herself that Olivia feels inferior to.

    We find out in this episode that it’s the ability to truly, honestly love without abandon that she envies about other versions of herself. Of course, we’d realized, at the end of the last season, that being in love re-animated how she saw herself and the world, and how she acted in it, so to hear her say that she chooses to remember it, to know a life filled by love despite the consequences was very Olivia, IMO. She’s not the Dunham-ator if not for her iron clad will.

    That earlier emptiness she felt vanished with the experiences of her past life, with the love she had for a man she couldn’t let go of, and so she made the decision to hold on to that feeling, because she realized it made her a better person. Ultimately, this is what happened to her at the end of season three.

    Arguably, we can make parallels to 6B. In that episode, Olivia tells Peter that she feels incapable of love because she won’t let herself. In this episode, she’s capable of love *because* she’s letting herself. Interesting juxtaposition, IMO. And just another degree of how this amazing show brings us full circle. I really liked that aspect.

    I also love the scene between Peter and Walter in the lab. This past hiatus, alot of disfavor was shown on Peter because he *rejected* Olivia yet again at the end of the last episode, though I felt him especially responsible and in the right at that time. It was nice to know too, that my opinion was shared with Walter, and of course, Peter himself. His internal battle, was written all over the young Bishop’s face, laying in that chair, and then Walter tells him he wouldn’t have had the strength to leave something he loves behind. Then he tells Peter that he’s a better man then him for finding such strength. Not only did I feel like this scene attested to Peter’s evolved maturity, his astounding character progression, if you will, but it also delved into the mystery of the series mytharc, with the use of the Greek phrase.

    Curious-er and Curious-er, that becomes.

    To find out too, that the Beacon is a tool that harbors The Observers essence, was a very awesome reveal. I took it as being some kind of capsule that allows them to exist in universes separate from the one in which they originate. This theory makes sense too, given the reason September was so valiant at guarding it in season one. I don’t know, necessarily, if this capsule houses only September, I’m under the impression that this a community hub so to speak, and I’ve a suspicion we may find out even more about this in later episodes.

    Touching on the Lincoln aspects of this episode, personally, I like the idea of the character, but sometimes, he feels a bit to out of place to me. Not because I’m bias to the *big three* characters, but simply because he comes off, it seems, at times, a bit like he’s trying to hard. Whether it’s to find himself or his place in this Fringe world, I don’t know, and yeah, it’s sweet that he cares for his parter so, but I hate how, in the back of my mind, I feel like he’s attempting to insert himself into places he doesn’t belong. The chemistry he has with Liv could be compared to a lamp and a sofa cushion. Dull and utterly stagnant. Oddly enough though, I found his interactions with Peter earlier in the season to be the most believable. Hell, I was even voting for them to be bros, to be honest. That being said, Alt-Lincoln doesn’t have this feel to me at all, and I do, honestly, appreciate his character so much more. I’m holding out hope though for episode seventeen. I’m hoping it makes my little heart strings tug for a little because so far, I got nothing.

    The Nina and Olivia scene was the best so far this season. I feel like the contrived feel of the last ‘I love you’ from Olivia to her sub-mother redeemed itself in this episode. I genuinely felt the love between the two here, and felt very, very grateful for this scene. And as I mentioned in above posts, Olivia asking Nina to hold on to her was sweet, and perhaps pointed to the circular aspects of the series overall. Even in season one, Nina felt a unique compassion for Olive. And wouldn’t it be the coolest flustercluck, if that was because of this timeline now. Makes you wonder….

    Coming to a close, I can’t say I didn’t really like that last scene, particularly because of the way it was shot. That being said, the fact that there was no dialogue made it even better. I have to admit, I was trying to figure out in my own mind how in the hell that conversation would go down.

    Regardless of my valiant efforts rehearsing the possibilities during the commercial break, it was nice to get my stress relieved when they spoke without speaking. I think it made it all the more epic, specifically because anything they would have said to each other, would have diffused the feel of the scene. The fact that they didn’t have to, made it all the more powerful. They both understood, without speaking, the ‘what now’, that moment was giving them. The last time she saw him, he said he was going home, and then he appears, right there, on her doorstep. Alas, he went home. And walking up to him, she understood this. Ergo, she runs to him, and then it’s that GREAT three-sixty cam shot. Don’t know why I love that aspect so much, but I really, really do.

    Long post short, this episode ranks pretty high with me. I adored the character interaction.

    Well-loved. Like: Thumb up 52

    • scully8 says

      Rae . .. you rock!

      I look forward to your posts; always so thoughtful and right on point (at least for me). This was a fantastic episode and you listed all of the reasons why. Thanks!

      Well-loved. Like: Thumb up 11

    • JM says

      I agree with you about the olivia/Nina scene, it was 10 times more believable than the last time olivia said “i love you” Blair Brown should be in the show more often!

      Like: Thumb up 7

      • Rae says

        My mom adores this show (if it’s possible) more than me, and her take on the differences between the two scenes, was that one was Alt-Nina and one was actually, Olivia’s adoptive mother. My mom is under the impression that because it was Meana who Olivia recited her original sentiment too, it simply didn’t hold the same ‘feel’ as this last one.

        Suppose I couldn’t disagree with her, but overall, I like to think it was the context of why she’d said it that felt more believable. In this episode, it felt like it came from her heart. In Forced Perspective, it felt as if Olivia had said it because she felt obligated to tell Nina, given the recent comtemplations of her own mortality.

        Well-loved. Like: Thumb up 11

        • mlj102 says

          Perhaps I missed something, but do we know for sure which Nina Olivia was interacting with in Forced Perspective? I was under the impression that alternate Nina only impersonated Nina when she had to get to the cortexiphan and when she was “captured” by Jones. All other times we saw Nina this season (aside from the brief glimpse of her supervising Olivia’s cortexiphan dosing and again when they were captured), we would have been seeing Nina from this side who raised Olivia. It just doesn’t make sense how alternate Nina could have been the one in Nina’s office and interacting with Olivia without them having to actively do something to keep the real over here Nina out of the way, which they didn’t do.

          Well-loved. Like: Thumb up 11

          • scully8 says

            I believe you are correct, mlj102. It was ‘our’ Nina — Meana just said that during the interrogation.

            Also, my Mom loves, loves, loves Fringe as well as my 20 something neice and 50 something sister. My mom is the one who convinced me to give the series another chance . . . man, do I love my mother. :)

            Like: Thumb up 6

        • hsa says

          It s is very possible that your Mom loves the show more than you do. I have many friends who adore it. Our life experience plays into our appreciation of it, and we know a little about how critical love is to life. We also know there is very little great TV. So we savor Fringe.

          Like: Thumb up 5

          • Rae says

            I loved this post. And it’s exactly my viewpoint too. :)

            These characters aren’t merely trying to exsist in a world of fringe things, they’re trying to solve Fringe things in this little world of love they’ve created. In one stance, they’re simply fighting off all the ebby-gebbies of the big bad world, in another, they have personal reason too, relationships that are grounding their decisions to keep fighting for what’s right. I like the latter, myself. It humanizes and redefines the whole show in aspects that we, the audience, can familiarize with.

            I can’t think of a better uniquely human emotion to invest in.

            Well-loved. Like: Thumb up 13

      • Rae says

        I can’t help it. I love this show so much. I was just as obsessed with The X-files back in the day. Not that I’m a nerd or anything….I totally did not just start watching Game of Thrones either…lol.

        What? I hate reality T.V. So sue me. lmao.

        Well-loved. Like: Thumb up 12

        • hsa says

          Rae-You can be my daughter, and we can spend hours talking Fringe. I never missed The Twilight Zone, X-Files or Battlestar Gallactica.

          Like: Thumb up 5

          • Rae says

            Okay! Yey! I’ll bring the M&M’s! lol…My sister is a HUGE Battlestar fan, owns the whole series, and my father and uncle own all of the Twilight Zone. What can I say, I’m a product of my own gene pool. ;)

            Like: Thumb up 3

  18. number six says

    So the beacon is a prison for Observers? Is that why they can’t touch it?

    The MoTW was creepy and very unsympathetic, which is rare in this show. Those guys trapped in that liquid-extracting chamber… *shudders*

    The last scene between between Nina and Olivia redeemed, what I consider the weakest relationship they’ve been trying to sell this season. All of their loving interactions felt unauthentic and forced, until this last one. If their connection is strong enough, if Olivia forgets their story, the feelings will remain, right? Isn’t that what this season is about?

    The stuff with Peter, the beacon and all those Observer items was amazing. I wish he could keep them all, but since September is back (a rogue?), he might need his things. But what about his wound? Was he cured, before they imprisoned him? Can he team up with Peter now, please? Those two together are awesome!

    Thank you very much for all those close-ups of Constipated!Lincoln. I felt very sorry… for myself, for having to be subjected to that torture. :(

    Hot debate. What do you think? Thumb up 9

    • JM says

      Yes it did redeem olivia/nina, i think one of the other weaker relationships on the show this season is walter/olivia, i think someone else mentioned before that they were trying to sell closeness to hard and that was very evident in their first in this episode the way walter said “olivia its so good to see you” just felt off to me, but the scene when she told him her memories was going was the quality of their relationship in the first three seasons, i hope it goes back to that, cause that felt like an organic father/surrogate daughter relationship the one they have up to now, has not been so, as most of the time olivia talks with walter like hes a retarded child.

      Like: Thumb up 4

      • number six says

        To be fair to Olivia, though, Walter behaves like a retarded child with her. I agree that their relationship this season is very weak, but I attribute it, in part, to a lack of chemistry between the actors. The writing isn’t the best, either. You have this guy, who used to abuse children (Olivia among them) for Science and they want me to believe she’d have a loving relationship with him? I’m sorry, but no. Their close relationship in S3 worked, because Peter was the catalyst and there was always this interesting undercurrent of, should I say disgust?, that prevented a gross father/daughter relationship. I guess that’s another problem, I have with their new relationship, I find it bordering on gross.

        Like: Thumb up 6

        • JM says

          Could you clarify what you mean by “gross” please? do you mean “gross” as in altlivia flirting with walter in 4.11 “gross”? :L

          The lack of chemistry between the two this season is weird though, cause torv and noble whenever their at comic con (atleast last year) do all their interviews together, and seem to get on really well, this was also evident at the paley center, so i dont really get it, but somethings missing. Perhaps intentionally.

          I do see what you mean about the child abuse thing, that is a good point.

          Like: Thumb up 2

          • number six says

            I find it gross, because of the child abuse. I get that she has forgiven him, but having a close relationship with the abuser… that’s completely different.

            I get that they didn’t intend to imply that Walter had an affair with Fauxlivia or, if they did, it was misleading and played for laughs, but the idea that Walter could have been interested in Olivia romantically makes the whole thing beyond sleazy. Walter’s jealousy of Peter hasn’t helped, either.

            Like: Thumb up 4

          • number six says

            Sorry, forgot to answer the part about actors getting on well and chemistry, maybe there is no correlation between the two. John Noble gets on very well with Joshua Jackson and Jasika Nicole and the scenes with them (in any combination) are always amazing. He and Lance Reddick don’t seem as close and yet I find their scenes together wonderful.

            Like: Thumb up 1

                • number six says

                  Maybe not. Some actors hate each other in real life and their onscreen chemistry is amazing and sometimes married actors cannot convey the tiniest bit of chemistry.

                  Like: Thumb up 3

                  • Rae says

                    Since watching the first episode of the series, I’ve never found Olivia and Walter’s chemistry to be especially contrived. In Subject 9, I especially liked it, how she, ultimately, was taking Peter’s place as caregiver and nurturer. Of course, not as exhaustedly as Astrid, but I appreciated the ‘rootbeer’ float scene, immensely.

                    For me, it drew parallels back to Subject 13, and the aspect of Walter having deep care for this vulnerable girl. I felt his words ‘this girl means a great deal to me’ played back on the screen, not only through this episode, but the adjoining ones as well. See, I never felt it forced or awkward because, IMO, this is a bit like something we would have seen in the earlier seasons sans junior Bishop.

                    Obviously, and maybe it’s because she ran away from the Cortexi-trials, that this Olivia forgave this brutally, addled man some time ago for what he did to her. Perhaps, because of her different up-bringing, forgiveness and compassion are things that came easier to her. Not to mention, he was her only hope to save her dying partner. It was my assumption that she empathized with Walter years ago, much in the same way Peter did in the beginning episodes, and it was that soft-spot for a worn, damaged man that ultimately fueled her compassion. Peter stayed out of guilt, in the OT, here, Olivia stayed out of desperation and that forced circumstance effected the way she may have once seen the good professor.

                    It’s possible too though, that her anger towards Walter, though it would have been founded in this season too, given the trials, was much less powerful. WE don’t know, exactly, how Olivia dealt in the aftermath of running away from the experiments. Perhaps they weren’t as bad as in the OT timeline, maybe, ultimately, she never blamed Walter, simply reverted all her anger on her stepfather.

                    Since day one, in this timeline, I’ve adored the relationship between the two, often times, I’m even re-hearing the words Peter says to Alt-Livia thinking she was The Dunhamator, saying she’s more patient with Walter. Interesting concept that they drew that characteristic into an Olivia without Peter.

                    In my opinion all of the separate definitions Peter gave Olivia to describe Alt-Liv’s differences are traits, somehow of this *new* Olivia. She’s easier with a smile, hurting in different ways, sure, she is still human, but not as haunted, as the OT one. And of course, we all know she’s all the things Peter explained in WTW. It’s all a bit compelling, to say the least, that this Olivia that he recognizes, that he knows is his despite his rational brain telling him it’s not possible, is the penultimate version of all the others.

                    And here, in this episode, she voices her doubt of that. Oh Olivia, if you only knew…

                    Anyway, getting back onto the topic of Wallie and Olive, I gotta admit, this is my favorite season between the two, conceptually. I even felt, that Olivia’s tolerance of him branches on something like a profound love for a poor, damaged man. And I felt that validated in Subject 9, with how she responded to the check-mark boxes on the slip that determined Walter’s fate. Because she cares for him, as a daughter would a father, in most ways. Regardless of their earlier past, she’s found it in herself to realize who and how this man has become and therefore, empathizes with him for it.

                    Of course, Astrid, will, IMO, forever fill the ‘sub-daughter’ role of Walter’s, but Olivia fills another branch of the same kind of relationship. In a family, children react differently towards their parents because of their personalities. Both Astrid and Olivia have taken on the role of ‘daughter’ in one way or another, and both have approached it, given their professions, in a different matter. That’s the over-arching relationship I’ve felt all this year play on screen.

                    The Lincoln/Walter relationship…yeah, I’ve still got nothin’…sorry Seth. I know it’s not your fault, man…..

                    Well-loved. Like: Thumb up 19

                    • shidey17 says

                      “It’s all a bit compelling, to say the least, that this Olivia that he recognizes, that he knows is his despite his rational brain telling him it’s not possible, is the penultimate version of all the others.”

                      I agree with this. When I was watching the scene between Olivia and Nina at the end, I felt that Olivia had it all wrong. She was saying she wanted to give in to BlueLiv’s memories because she was the better version – to me it’s the opposite and THIS Liv is the better version.

                      Like: Thumb up 6

                    • Rae says

                      Oh for sure, shidey, I agree with you. I’m glad I’m not the only one who has that opinion. This Olivia steals my heart away even more then the OT one. Didn’t think that was possible…

                      Well-loved. Like: Thumb up 11

                    • Rae says

                      Oh for sure, shidey, I agree with you. I’m glad I’m not the only one who has that opinion. This Olivia steals my heart away even more then the OT one. Didn’t think that was possible…

                      Like: Thumb up 5

  19. Dylan says

    That was not an episode worth four weeks waiting for.

    I found the case-of-the-week boring and unnecessary, and I never appreciate when a theme is laid on so thick that every different character literally explains it all to the audience.

    I also found, much like I did the explanation from last episode, that the reveal of the beacon felt empty, and failed to really explain why the Observers and the…whatever the heck that guy was in ‘The Arrival’, were all so hell bent on getting it back and afraid of what would happen if they failed.

    If it’s just a beacon…what’s the big deal?

    And we now know what the vast majority had already suggested the possibility shortly after the season began; that Peter was in his own universe. Once again, this revelation was explained to us via a character (I am beginning to fear that every remaining mystery will be resolved this way).

    So…unnecessary case-of-the-week, hollow reveals, mishandled thematic, and lack of progress or even reflection on the events of the last episode, all amounts to a Fringe episode I doubt I will ever revisit.

    Hot debate. What do you think? Thumb up 9

    • JM says

      I prefer to think of it as a transitional episode. It was ultimately neccessary to allow fringe to focus on the mythology aspect of fringe instead of the peter/olivia relationship, which i think/hope will rest neatly in the background with no break ups, so we focus solely on the universe stuff.

      Well-loved. Like: Thumb up 10

    • Ian S. says

      Answers through character are very important. If you ever watched Lost, two episodes before the series finale they had one big episode that answered a bunch of questions, but it felt sort of misplaced and took me a bit out of the story. Don’t get me wrong, I loved it, but it really took me out of the main plot. It just didn’t exactly fit.

      Answers that include our own characters are really nice I find because we get these big mysteries explained and so do our characters, which is important for them to understand what’s going on too. On Lost, the characters don’t know what the smoke monster is, where Jacob came from, or anything like that, but we as an audience do.

      I just like when my characters are in the mysteries too ;)

      Like: Thumb up 2

      • shidey17 says

        Agreed. I always prefer the “show-don’t-tell” method but I don’t think it would’ve worked here. The only other way they could’ve done it is in a conversation between the observers, like we saw in the early episodes of this season. But then Peter wouldn’t know, and that was the whole point. He can’t know this is his universe/timeline in an other way because everything looks the same.

        Totally agree on the episode of Lost you’re talking about too. Had none of the characters in it and because of that the revelations didn’t really give a big payoff.

        Like: Thumb up 4

        • Dylan says

          This is more in reference to the beacon rather than Peter’s situation (exposition in that circumstance is acceptable).

          And in regards to LOST, the penultimate episode ‘What They Died For’ (following on from the one you’re discussing) informed the characters of what they didn’t know (it also nicely re-clarified for the audience).

          Like: Thumb up 2

          • Ian S. says

            The showrunners said we’re not done with Observer mythology this season, there’s still tons more coming, so I’m sure the beacon will be more explained.

            And in ‘What They Died For’, I don’t just mean Jacob saying he made the smoke monster, I mean the frozen donkey wheel, Egyptian statues, and especially the cork.

            Like: Thumb up 0

      • Dylan says

        I live by the ‘show don’t tell’ principal. A little exposition here and there is acceptable, but Fringe seems to be a little over-reliant nowadays on characters explaining away mysteries.

        I think the LOST episode you’re discussing is ‘Across the Sea’. If so, the exposition in that episode was acceptable because of the context; the characters were actually being taught things by another, similar to life lessons. That is an acceptable form of exposition, whereas last night’s Fringe could have tweaked the set up slightly and had September’s re-appearance scene occur without then having September explain what just happened; we would have already had enough material to piece it together ourselves.

        Fringe hasn’t always been like this, it’s just another reason why season 4 is failing to meet my expectations as a member of the audience.

        Like: Thumb up 3

        • Darth Simous says

          Dylan, always a pleasure reading your comments, i too agree this episode was over-exposed during the last 40 or so days, and after watching it, have the same feeling of “forced” answers, that the showrunners are trying to throw at us. Come on guys, give us answers the “Fringie” way, not like this, “lighthearted” way.

          Like: Thumb up 5

          • Darth Simous says

            Besides, and almost forgot, Walter was able to extract a veeery slow motion video, from a 30FPS – 30 Dollars, video-capturing teddy-bear, with the aid of a super-duper M.I.T. machine, and actually “see” the Observers in their Super-Speed actions to exctract September? I don’t thing so. Even for Fringe, this was, sorry to say, quite an unremarkable idea…

            Like: Thumb up 6

    • onlimain says

      “That was not an episode worth four weeks wating for.”

      I have to agree with this statement, but amend it slightly in that I would have preferred to see this episode the following week after 4×14 aired. (And *then* we could have gone on a 4 week hiatus, thus avoiding March Madness/Hunger Games opening altogether.) While I liked this episode more than I disliked it, it felt more like an epilogue to the previous 2 episodes than something we needed to wait to see. I feel like… if we had seen this episode the week after 4×14, it would have felt like this arc was resolved & what we had to look forward to was them tackling the DRJ mytharc together.

      I also agree that some of the explanations/confirmation/conclusions drawn could have been handled better. I don’t know; I’m still trying to sort out my feelings about this episode. :-\

      Like: Thumb up 3

      • willg says

        I loved this episode. You are right that it should have aired right after 4 14, and it was supposed to. The baseball episode affected this episode as well and it was supposed to be the one before the hiatus.

        Like: Thumb up 4

        • shidey17 says

          Totally agree – if they would’ve taken the break after this episode it would have been a natural stopping point after the P/O arc was complete.

          Like: Thumb up 2

  20. Jed Fish Gould says

    Hello. My name is Astro. My boss thinks he can see light particles from a Vermont Teddy Bear. Gotta go.

    Like: Thumb up 6

  21. mlj102 says

    It has been interesting to read through the comments and to see how polarized fans are in regards to this episode: people seem like they either absolutely loved it or absolutely despised it. Personally, I’m somewhat in the middle, though leaning more towards the “loved it” side. But still, there were some things I really liked about this episode, and some things I really didn’t like.

    Things I didn’t like:

    The Case: Basically we were dealing with a creepy looking guy who targeted couples in love, killed the husband in a gruesome way, made some special sort of perfume that was a sort of love potion that would cause the wife to briefly love him, kiss him, then the effects would fade away and the wife would fight back, so he would kill her, too. I found that whole concept to be quite disturbing (more so than the majority of Fringe cases) and I felt that it was lacking the appropriate development and depth that the best cases seem to have. There were also moments where it felt like it was dragging on quite a bit. It just felt rather shallow to me, and was disappointing because I’d had high hopes for this case.

    Lincoln: I’m not one of those fans who is strongly opposed to Lincoln’s character, (though I have always said that I prefer Over There Lincoln to Over Here Lincoln) but he just becomes more and more useless with each passing episode. I can’t figure out what they want to do with his character. And as far as the potential Lincoln/Olivia relationship, I’m not sure what they’re trying to say there, either. If you’re looking at it in terms of what was presented in this episode, I would conclude that he’s supposed to be compared with the one woman’s husband, who had been her best friend who always comforted her, and in the end they got married, but that relationship was never really founded on true love. So are they basically saying that he’s in love with Olivia, but he doesn’t really love her? That if they were to get in a relationship, it would ultimately fail because he only thinks he loves her?

    It seemed like they were clearly hinting at a possible relationship throughout this episode, yet at the same time, they obviously shut the door on that. Was it done that way with the intention of making us feel sorry for Lincoln? While I didn’t feel overwhelming sympathy towards his character, I’ve got to admit that I do feel a certain amount of pity for his character. As annoying as he may be in not contributing anything, he just can’t win, in any universe. I got the distinct impression from the scene between him and Olivia that while he obviously seems to be attracted to her, she thinks of him as nothing more than a little brother, perhaps good friend. Which seems to be the same situation on the other side. At any rate, I found the deliberate focus on the two of them (the looks they would exchange at certain key moments, the discussion they had, etc.) to be distracting, forced, and irritating.

    Dialogue: This is sort of a mixed one. There were moments when the dialogue felt extremely forced and contrived, though at other times it managed to fit perfectly with the theme of the episode and was very powerful. But there were just a couple of exchanges that, for whatever reason, just didn’t work well with me, like it was a little bit too forced and too overdramatic.

    Things I liked:

    Peter’s story: I quite enjoyed his journey in following the clue left by the observer, leading him back to the apartment, then to the beacon, and ultimately to the return of September. I thought it was a very natural way to basically continue the discussion between the two of them from the previous episode. It worked very well for me, and I like the idea that the events from the Arrival could have directly resulted in Peter being able to discover the beacon in this episode. It’s almost as if they’re saying that, by Walter helping to protect the beacon, he actually contributed to helping September to return and thus also assisting September in being able to assure Peter that he was home and this is his Olivia. That when Olivia saw the beacon disappear, little did she know that when it would reappear, it would hold the key to her finding love and happiness. I just think that idea is really neat. Perhaps there’s more to it than that, but that’s how I am choosing to interpret it for the time being.

    Olivia and Nina: As others have already mentioned, the interactions between them were extremely well written and well acted. I liked the subtle connection of Nina’s interest in Olivia in early seasons and the relationship they had in this Peterless timeline. I always found her interest in Olivia to be hinting towards something more (though I always thought it was for negative reasons), as well as her motherly sort of comments (“I would tell this to my own daughter,” etc.), so I like the suggestion that somehow those interactions were influenced (consciously or subconsciously) by this relationship that technically never actually existed, but potentially could have.

    Production: This episode was visually interesting and pleasing to watch. I liked the angles and the way scenes were set up. It was just put together really well.

    As for the biggest reveal, I have posted several comments stating my opinion that this couldn’t be the original timeline. And I still don’t think we can claim that it is the original timeline, because clearly things did happen differently. But I do like the Observer’s explanation that Peter couldn’t be fully erased because those who cared about him couldn’t let him go, and he couldn’t let them go, either. And if they’re going to have Olivia and Walter return to their original characters with their original memories, I guess that mostly takes care of the differences from the original timeline and the revised timeline. I still don’t like it and I still don’t think it makes complete sense. But I’m willing to accept it.

    I’m still of the opinion that it was too much back and forth as far as the Peter and Olivia relationship is concerned. The whole “This isn’t my Olivia; this is my Olivia” felt forced and unnecessary. But they did a good job of resolving it in this episode and I’m happier with it than I had expected to be, considering how they went back on it yet again as Peter realized this really is his Olivia. I thought it especially helped as they showed the exchange between Peter and Walter, and how Peter’s actions distinguish him from Walter. I thought it was a neat touch to show how Peter was able to overcome and become a better man than his father by being willing to let Olivia go when he considered that she wasn’t his Olivia, while Walter was unwilling to let Peter go despite the fact that he knew he wasn’t his son. This helped to add significance and purpose behind Peter’s choice to leave Olivia in the last episode, and made it not as annoying that they broke up and then reunited again so quickly.

    I’m happy for both Peter and Olivia and I’m glad to have this issue resolved. I hope that they will leave the characters to enjoy their happiness for awhile and focus on other things a bit more now. Though I am concerned that this will be short lived. After all, we still have to worry about September’s prediction that Olivia must die, and what exactly he meant by that. Somehow I doubt he was simply speaking metaphorically about this new Olivia without memories of Peter having to “die” as original Olivia’s memories take over. At any rate, I’m interested to see more of this transition from revised to original, to see exactly what happens with Olivia and how things change for her, and also to see if it will eventually happen for other characters, as well.

    Well-loved. Like: Thumb up 24

    • Anne in Van says

      So well said that I have barely anything to add. Very mixed feelings on this one. Loved the whole mythology and relationships related moments. Really didn’t like the MOW. Come on, such a lack of imagination here, just a plagiarism of “The Perfume” by Patrick Suskind. But quite a bad one, as the book was one of the best I’ve ever read.
      Happy with the ending, as I love seeing P&O together but also because that means we can move on.
      Mostly happy with the episode but I rated it 7/10. Definitely not the best ever, the 2 previous ones were way better IMO.

      But Jeez that feels good to have my Fringe shot!

      Well-loved. Like: Thumb up 10

      • Darth Simous says

        Anne, my turn to praise your own points, perfectly said, IMO. I also gave this episode a 7, mostly just for having watched one of my favorite shows, after a long hiatus. I am also aware that the producers have already – most likely – all of the rest of the season’s storyline already written, but i am together with many people, who have stated already their opinion – and i agree with them 100%, let’s hope no more standalone-heavy episodes to come, hoping they will be mainly focused on the main storyline, for Fringe’s sake…

        Like: Thumb up 6

    • Roneo says

      Yes, few more to add. Very much agree with almost everything.

      Just that my take on what the parallel history Lincoln-Olivia husband-wife tells
      “So are they basically saying that he’s in love with Olivia, but he doesn’t really love her?”
      is that is Olivia who loves Lincoln but is not in love with him.

      “And if they’re going to have Olivia and Walter return to their original characters with their original memories, I guess that mostly takes care of the differences from the original timeline and the revised timeline. I still don’t like it and I still don’t think it makes complete sense. But I’m willing to accept it.”
      I really would like to recover the original line of events; even little nugget. But I’m afraid that with the statement of him being a mistake are giving us the trail to think that with this new timeline there’s some kind of universal correction.

      Like: Thumb up 1

    • shidey17 says

      Yep. It was awesome. Totally agree. Also, I think sometimes we forget about how amazing Michael Cerveris is. We always comment on the other actors, but I think he is just simply amazing.

      Well-loved. Like: Thumb up 10

  22. number six says

    Did I see September smiling a little, when he was talking to Peter? He is adorable!

    Well-loved. Like: Thumb up 12

  23. JM says

    When September said “There is no scientific explanation for what has happened” did anyone else immediately get flashes before their eyes saying “COP OUT! COP OUT!” lol

    Like: Thumb up 6

    • number six says

      Of course! I can’t say I expected any different, though. In that regard, they didn’t disappoint.

      Like: Thumb up 5

      • JM says

        Long shot: Did you also start humming the tune of “you spin me right round, baby right round” when peter spun olivia round? lol…..

        Like: Thumb up 2

    • Rae says

      Not particularly, I did however hear myself say that a couple people owe me a few bucks because I just won this bet. lol…

      Like: Thumb up 2

  24. mrflamethunder says

    Not a fan of this week’s COTW.
    But love all the scenes of our beloved characters.
    The end is tooooooo short!!

    Like: Thumb up 6

  25. James says

    Umm, I thought the guy introduced in this episode was supposed to the ‘Big Bad’ for the rest of the season?

    Or am I making this up?!

    Like: Thumb up 3

    • Rae says

      Kay, everyone knows that DRJ is the Big Bad of any season he’s in. Harris is so kick-ass, he trumps any other possible bad dude in the season run. I love him so much. Never thought I’d have villian-love. I’ve learned to like new things…And I like liking new things. :)

      Like: Thumb up 5

  26. Lincless says

    So we finally saw Nina Sharp in the kitchen :D
    And yes, they announced him as the “big bad of the season”.

    Like: Thumb up 3

  27. DeepRunner says

    So did anyone else notice that “The Adventures of Scooby Doo” was playing on Walter’s TV in the lab early in the show? And that Jefferson Airplane’s “White Rabbit” was playing in the background?

    Some of the key questions I have going forward are:

    * What is going on between the Observers? Someone shot September, and the others locked September out of the universe. How? And what will September do, now that he is back? Is there going to be an act of vengeance or rebellion between the Observers, a war, almost?

    The Observers have seemed very much like the Borg of TNG fame–a collective. Anyone who goes very far off the reservation ends up in the worst of circumstances. It is interesting that September has talked several times about various possible futures, while the others have clung to the pristine view of the timeline being sacrosanct. September has acknowledged the effects of his mistake, and yes, he has tried to re-calibrate things to the way they should have been. But if the Observers are the Borg, September is Hugh.

    * Walter, throughout this episode, seemed very fatherly to Peter. His hurt “You didn’t tell ME!” when Peter told him that he was catching the bus out of town seemed very much like our Walter, as did his “The only thing I care about is what he did to YOU.” It was a subtle coda back to season 1’s “Bound,” in the dialogue between Peter and Olivia in the lab, culminating in Peter saying to Olivia “I care about you,” and then quickly following that statement with…stuff. I said earlier that I expect Walter and Peter’s relationship to grow substantially. How and when will Walter’s memory come back? I think parts of it are coming back, but will it come back fully? Will he remember how he went back in time to place the various parts of the boom-boom machine? Is this the version of Walter we will have to accept? My guess is probably not.

    * Will Olivia really face a gut-wrenching death in this series? She is supposed to die in all possible timelines, but does that mean she ends up “looking down the barrel of a hot metal .45″ by series end? Who is Mr. X, another Cortexiphan kid, or someone with a different tie to Olivia, or Peter, or Walter?

    * Will Lincoln ever be appealing to the legion of Fringies who view him as an ant at a picnic? I am not a fan of Lincoln. I am guessing episode 17 is designed for us to grow some affinity for Lincoln, but…

    Well-loved. Like: Thumb up 10

    • Rae says

      All my same questions indeed. Along with DRJ’s endgame motive when it comes to the Shape-Shifters. Can’t wait till we get this resolved. I’ve a feeling it’s gonna blow our minds. As well as whether or not he does have a deeper relationship with Olivia then first assumed. Daddy-o, perhaps?

      *puts thinking cap on*

      Like: Thumb up 4

      • DeepRunner says

        I am not sure about the Daddy-o relationship (has sort of a “Luke, I’m your father” feel to it), but I would bet that DRJ was one of the people involved in the Cortexiphan trials. Now, THAT would be an interesting reveal.

        Like: Thumb up 1

  28. Real1 says

    That was really really a strong ep and we have all in it : case of the week , relationship between characters and Sep is back !!

    Now what did happened exactly ? are they trying to say that all a long Peter was at home but people are in different stat of mind ? as s3ep6 where Walternat was changing the frequency of the people … So is that mean BBM did changed the frequency of mind for both worlds and some how Olivia earned her memory back ??

    9.9/10

    Like: Thumb up 2

    • Rae says

      I don’t think it has anything to do with a ‘frequency’ per say, more of a quantum entanglement that knows no bounds. The states of mind could be blamed on the repercussion of the choice Peter made. It’s my assumption, that the consequences of erasing himself from time is that the people he loved wouldn’t remember him. In the same breath, the people he loved held on to him, because love trumps those consequence. It’s the connections we make, the people in our lives we touch, that ultimately give us a meaning for existence.

      Really, it’s all a big, circular progression. Not that anyone would have guessed that. What show do they think is? Fringe?….;)

      Like: Thumb up 6

      • Real1 says

        Actually I agree with what you are saying , but just to help people to understand what’s going on .. to link the story .. trying to understand what BBM did and how no one is remembering Peter and also how this Olivia is now having the one Olivia which Peter in love with .. Well Sep said it clear : she is your Olivia . So because she is his Olivia = BBm did change the frequency of mind … that’s my explanation .. maybe I am wrong .. but that’s what i got from this wonderful episode .

        I think Sep had another observer who’s helping him .. the one which fired Peter’s eye with lentil …. ??

        And Totally I agree .. It’s Fringe after all :)

        Like: Thumb up 1

  29. Rae says

    Gonna throw this out there…I ship Tommy and Astrid. There, I said it. I think that would be cool, Astrid getting some love by another normal person who’s been thrust into this world with these people.

    I hold out a faint hope. lol…

    Like: Thumb up 4

      • Rae says

        The other agent who’s been there since the beginning of the season. The one that played babysitter to Walter on night shifts. He returned to the lab with Astrid in this one with that device from MIT. Personally, I think he’s kinda cute. lol.

        Like: Thumb up 6

  30. FringeFriday says

    Well, finally the weeks of waiting are over!

    Case of the Week totally reminded me of an episode of “Criminal Minds” where a guy made soap out of women- so kinda copied…

    Peter’s Observer “hunt” was great- the end was perfect for all the P/O shippers. I still think there is going to be a Linc involved. The writers told us there was going to be a love triangle. has there already been on and I’ve missed it??

    so now that it’s clear that we are in the correct universe, let’s get back to the David Robert Jones arc! PLEASE!!!!

    Like: Thumb up 3

  31. lost_stef says

    what a great episode. Let me say it was well worth the 4 week wait.

    im not ashamed to say this but this episode totally had be crying from when Olivia and Nina shared their sweet moment together, from Peter realising that this is his home and this is his Olivia and then expecially when Olivia & Peter finally ended up together finally! The last scene was so beautiful i couldnt have been better. im gonna watch it over and over again now :)

    im glad that this season is now progessing foward and we are finally getting answers. I love fringe so much, i hope the scary dude doesnt try to kill me because he can sense im in love lol

    this episode got a 10/10 from me and really looking forward to the next 7 episodes in a row

    Like: Thumb up 7

  32. lost_stef says

    Do you think the screen title will stay amber or will it change back to blue now that we know that this is the proper timeline/universe???

    Like: Thumb up 2

    • niRti says

      My guess is we’re gonna have like a mix of blue and ambar…. I’d love to go back to full-on blue tho.

      Like: Thumb up 2

      • lizw65 says

        There have been blue flashes in the amber opening credits all along this season, but it looked to me as though they were getting a lot stronger in this episode.

        Like: Thumb up 3

        • Roneo says

          It could be. I was paying closed attention but I can’t say for sure….
          But I hope it will be bluer and bluer next episodes.

          Like: Thumb up 0

  33. Kelly says

    I’m surprised no one has mentioned Walter’s hilarious beaver-line yet. :P Had me in stitches. A+

    Well-loved. Like: Thumb up 10

    • JM says

      Look all it is is that someones gotta sit lincoln down and set things straight and say something like this:”Shes a 30 year old woman, you look 12, this is a network tv show we dont do statutory rape…..sorry.”

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  34. James says

    I thought the case-of-the-week was actually pointless. We learnt nothing of Michael Masse’s character.

    I think this should of been a straight mythology episode.

    Keep the Olivia/Nina scenes, Olivia/Walter scenes, Peter and September’s house, the beacon quest, and Peter/September scenes, and then fill the rest with the characters reflecting on recent events.

    The case-of-the-week felt like padding until we got to the good stuff.

    Like: Thumb up 6

    • James says

      Heck, we could have even had a Nina/Walter reconciliation scene, as she mentioned that she had spoken to him.

      Like: Thumb up 4

  35. Robert Ariadne says

    Ehh, I don’t know what to make of that. There was nothing new revealed that the people here haven’t already figured out months ago.

    Michael Massee was very underwhelming as the villain. I much, much preferred my theory that he’d be a king Observer who would come in to clean up the mess that September created this season. They didn’t do a very good job explaining his motives and origins; like who was that woman in his picture, and what happened to his face.

    I swear to God, I almost punched my TV in whenever the camera zoomed in on Lincoln while someone was talking about love. WE KNOW LINCOLN’S IN LOVE WITH OLIVIA! STOP BEATING US OVER THE HEAD WITH IT! I am so sick of this Lincoln. He hasn’t contributed anything to the lineup this season. Don’t get me wrong: I love the Lincoln from Over There. My fondest wish is that he gets together with Fauxlivia. But I hope this Lincoln is killed off in the most brutal way imaginable.

    I’m happy the beacon from season one made another appearance. I didn’t guess that it’s a way for imprisoned Observers to escape back into this universe. September’s appearance was a waste of time; instead of going on about 1985 last episode, why didn’t he just say “One more thing, this IS your timeline and she’s YOUR Olivia. Have a good time with all the sex (but use protection, we don’t want a repeat of that last incident).” Two seconds, and we would’ve had a happy ending four weeks ago.

    About the only real saving grace was more Walter and the excellent music (White Rabbit in Walter’s lab, the instrumental when Carr was next to his victims, and whatever that song was when Carr was in his lab looking at that picture.) Thusly, for the first time ever (and hopefully the last time ever), I voted 4.

    Like: Thumb up 0

  36. shidey17 says

    So I was just thinking about all the things we’ve seen in this new timeline that are throwbacks to previous seasons:

    – the creature from the transformation, next week
    – be a better man than your father
    – the nina/olivia relationship

    I feel like I’m forgetting all the most important ones, but you get my point….

    Anyway…..the showrunners have always said they know how Fringe ends and how it gets there….

    This season proves 1 of 2 things:

    – they are either Freaking Geniuses and have had this planned all along

    – or they have been incredibly lucky that they’ve been able to tie this together to look like they know what they’re doing

    I tend to believe it’s the former, and I’m really excited about what’s to come!

    Like: Thumb up 3

    • Dylan says

      I don’t believe that any writers knows the details of their entire story from beginning to end. Aspects of it, sure, but especially with TV, uncertainly over the success and therefore length of your programme, an assortment of writers rather than just yourself, outside interferences, etc.

      I believe Fringe has gotten lucky, and, in some cases, lazy. I firmly believe that the parallel universe plot was pre-planned, but this current storyline I believe was a last minute development.

      I will hope that they have everything planned out now, but I don’t expect that my beloved season 1-3 plot to ever be resolved – which causes much pain.

      Like: Thumb up 4

      • Briar says

        I have to agree with you. I don’t know how last minute the alternative, Peter-less time line actually was, but it dragged on far too long. It has taken them 16 episodes to finish a story line that should have been finished in 6. Once Peter was back, the question of where he had returned to needed to be addressed at once, since it was obvious that he was wrong about having the return home. We had been told from the start that he was erased from the timeline, so this *must* have been the original universe, because you can’t erase someone from a universe where he had never existed. He had to have been there to start with for that to happen. Peter is far too bright not to have realised this, and to have him moping around for ten episodes or whatever in a frigid version of the series where the key relationships had been erased as well made him look less than his genius self. The past few episodes, where he continued to resist the clear evidence and rebuff Olivia were especially irritating. They even had to make Walter the “devil’s advocate” to reinforce his argument he was distorting Olivia’s memories and harming her. Walter hasn’t been himself at all this season and I so miss him. Anyway, this “ET Go Home” plot line was all dramatic padding to spin the season out, I think, and I am starting to fear that the truth of the matter is that the writers don’t have an idea of where to go and how to get there. I love Fringe. Every new episode is a gift, but I think it has been partially thrown away during the first two thirds of this season, which has merely been marking time. I just hope they come up with something more convincing for the final seven episodes, and something good enough to earn a fifth season, if they get it. Because I really want them to.

        Like: Thumb up 4

      • Darth Kate says

        my thoughts exactly. they’re throwing all the shout-outs to past seasons in there to make it look like they planned this all along even tough the shift in the plot has been so incredibly jarring and silly.

        Like: Thumb up 2

    • LI Fringiac says

      I agree that the former is the likely point proven. In plenty of interviews, they have said they know where it is going.
      Some of the other symbolic references I saw:
      – Someone above mentioned Scooby-Doo playing behind Walter in the lab. It’s no clear to me yet what that means, but I’m sure it means something.
      – I also noticed the vase of white tulips on the table at Olivia and Nina’s breakfast get-together, a reference to S2 Ep 18.
      The episode title certainly had tentacles into almost all the stories this week, including the case of the week. Indeed, Anson took great care in who he targeted, steering away from one couple in the park when their son came into the picture, and going after Andrew Sutter’s lover, instead of the wife. That whole dialogue between Olivia and Dianna Sutter, along with Anson telling Olivia he could smell that she’s in love, are contributing factors in Olivia giving herself permission to accept and move on with these ‘new’ memories of her old-timeline self, and get back with Peter when he ‘finds’ himself to be in ‘his’ timeline’.
      I gave this episode a ‘9’ because of all this. I can only hope the rest of S4 are all 9s or 10s.

      Like: Thumb up 3

  37. matt says

    Michael Cerveris is my favourite fringe ingredient by far. I thought he was going to kill the sh** out of Peter or something. When he returned to the universe he was scaring the cr** out of me! when he cocked his head to the side and said whatever friendly thing he said I thought the episode was going to go all horror movie for sure. I thought he was going to declare war on the other observers or something and do something crazy and magical. amazing acting and misdirection skills!

    and, at the risk of speaking too soon or what have you, I have to say it:

    WHY, OH WHY, DID NOTHING LIKE THIS HAPPEN IN LOST? you know what I mean

    Like: Thumb up 7

    • James says

      Hell yes. I thought “oh shit, massive plot twist”.

      When September said “thank you”, and Peter replied with “for what?”, I was half-hoping September would say “for setting me free, so I can take over”, but less corny than that!

      Like: Thumb up 2

      • says

        September, the mild-mannered, jalapeno loving, slushie slurping Observer creeped you out. Say it ain’t so.

        Just like Clarence Oddbody in It’s A Wonderful Life, and his message of how each man’s life touches so many other lives. When he isn’t around he leaves an awful hole, doesn’t he. Nice little wink from the writers, and to show that September has indeed earned his wings.

        Like: Thumb up 5

        • shidey17 says

          lol it was just for a moment…the way his head was cocked to the side and the way the light was hitting him just right….dude looked damn creepy.

          Like: Thumb up 0

  38. kidentropia says

    For a moment there i thought Peter was going to become an Observer, like he was going to the future and become one of them. Or actually span the whole Observer genealogy; now, i´m going to speculate here (can i? i mean, is speculation here considered spoiler material? i hope not!); i´m going to speculate wildly and say that, with the re-existence of Peter, Henry exists in the altuniverse, AND PERHAPS Henry is the first Observer? xD

    Like: Thumb up 1

    • DeepRunner says

      No, because in wiping out Peter, they wiped out Henry. He was never supposed to be born, at least not to Peter and Fauxlivia. It may be that a version of Henry is born to Peter and Olivia. But your question brings up an interesting point. If Peter came back because of the ones who loved him and the ones he loved, did Fauxlivia figure into that equation? I think probably not, because while Fauxlivia obviously loved him, when he found out who she was, he stopped caring for her. Sort of a nice nod to the episode Reciprocity, that which we touch touches us.

      Like: Thumb up 0

  39. Darth Kate says

    When Albus Dumbledore told Harry Potter that he had been saved from Voldemort as an infant by the power of love it was cute and endearing, largely because i was EIGHT YEARS OLD at the time i was reading it. Also magic actually existed in that story. Fringe is sci-fi. Saying that the laws of the universe were broken by the power of love is juvenile and a complete writing cop-out. I honestly cannot understand how other viewers could not have their intelligence totally insulted by this. The writers are playing us for fools, guys, and they’re getting away with it.

    Like: Thumb up 3

    • JM says

      Lol as i stated above i did think cop out as soon as september said “there is no scientific explanation”. And i would have been insulted if i hadnt already expected that kind of explanation, wyman and pinkner go on about the “power of love” in every interview they do lol.

      Like: Thumb up 1

  40. FJ says

    Dylan, Darth Kate:

    I’ve decided to start another thread after reading your response to my comment from last night.

    I don’t want to spend too much time responding to your specific responses, which were highly dismissive and indicated you did not acknowledge or understand the thrust of my comments.

    First, the suggestion that you stop watching a show you no longer enjoy is (and will always remain) highly relevant. Many on this blog wonder why you continue to waste your time on a program that disappoints you so. Do you enjoy self-torture or is it something else? I’ve been reading comments from both of you about the program since the season 4 premiere. You are consistently negative and bemoan the status of Fringe. At this point, the fact that you continue to watch is baffling to me and others. Your rationale that your self-professed love for Fringe’s past glories is no longer an adequate explanation for your behavior.

    Second, about my comment that until you create something of value you have less right to complain. I was encouraging you to begin engaging in constructive criticism of the program — or to do something about the underlying economic and creative issues that are negatively impacting Fringe.

    With that being said, let me engage in some constructive criticism of my own and suggest a way forward for fans of Fringe and all serialized sci-fi dramas.

    Let me begin by saying that I too have been disappointed by season 4 of Fringe. I thought the first half of the season was mediocre and only started to pick up when the DRJ arc launched. The stand-alone episodes have been distracting from the main mythology plot. I also don’t buy this whole “love is the answer” theme, as it really has moved us away from the science-centric aspects of the program I enjoyed previously.

    However, I refuse to throw the baby out with the bathwater. Fringe has shown flashes of genius (and art) this season that have kept me riveted to my couch, leaning forward to learn more. No other show on television does that for me. This allows me to forgive the show’s many flaws.

    In addition, I am more forgiving of the show’s missteps because I recognize the challenges faced by producers and writers on the show. (In fact, I think many others do so as well, which is why they take the good with the bad.) I’ll talk about a few of them here.

    The Nature of Network TV

    Let us not forget that Fringe is struggling against a big fundamental problem: the fact that it is on network TV. As Josh Wheedon recently stated at South by Southwest, network execs don’t care about art. In fact, they can’t afford to care because they are punished or rewarded based on whether they produce television programming that makes the network money. The fact that they take chances on programs like Fringe, and stick with them, is very admirable in this environment. It’s much cheaper to produce yet another reality TV show or pump out schlock to generate ratings and revenue. This is what the once great SciFi channel (yes I still use the old name) has become. It takes guts to go against this trend, which is why I am justified calling Fringe “art.”

    So, where does this place the Fringe writers? When each show is being produced, they get notes from the network on what works and does not work (according to them). The network wants to increase or maintain ratings, so they instruct the writers to put things in the script they think will “sell” with the audience. For example, they might have said:

    -People need something to hook on to. We need more case of the week stuff so that people don’t get lost and can have something to relate to
    -People need romance. Put Peter and Olivia together so that people have another reason to watch
    -We need to reset the show, things have gotten too confusing and convoluted

    If the producers and writers receive notes like that, they have two choices. Ignore the network or try to meet their demands in a way that is still consistent with the story.

    Also, it’s clear Fringe’s budget has been cut. The network is losing money on the program so Fringe has to do more with less.

    How These Realities Have Impacted Fringe

    Now, with the environmental context for Fringe firmly in mind, one can then focus on why the show runners have made the choices they made. If they want to keep the network marginally happy, they can’t ignore the notes. In the meantime, what they likely REALLY want to do is fully flesh out the mythology and tell the story they want to tell Do you really think the writers want to spend as much time on the Peter/Olivia arc? Perhaps, but not as much as they have been doing. Do you REALLY think they want to have as many insipid case of the weeks as they’ve been having? I’m not in the writers’ room, but I have to think not.

    The fact that Fringe (mostly) succeeds despite these significant obstacles supports my contention that what the writers are doing is akin to art.

    How to Move Forward

    For a long time, I’ve thought that the network (or even cable) model of creating television is outdated and outmoded. It’s almost like what they say about running a solid business online, relying on advertising revenue alone is not a business model.

    I don’t have the data on this, but I think the audience of people who enjoy serialized television that is challenging and unique has a lot of economic power. It’s also been clearly demonstrated that we are early and active adopters of technologies that allow us to consume entertainment on our own terms. We DON’T want to be served advertising we don’t want to see. We also have the income to support our choices with our dollars.

    I think the sci-fi fandom is the perfect audience with which to experiment by creating a new business model for television. Netflix seems to be moving this way, which makes me very happy. Fringe (and shows like it) would thrive in an environment this is not dependent on advertising, but subscriptions.

    My recommendation would be for an ambitious entrepreneur (or Netflix) to create an online-only/on-demand network devoted to serialized sci-fi television. The network would be for the fans and financially supported by the fans. The network could start out by resurrecting franchises with very strong fan bases, such as Star Trek, Firefly and Farscape. In addition, they could license programs like Fringe to bring in additional people.

    Fans would be asked to pay a nominal amount — say $20 bucks per month — to access the channel. In addition, those who don’t want to pay the full fee can choose to purchase programs or seasons a-la-carte. Each year, the network would make renewal or cancellation decisions based on fan demand, social media activity, etc. In addition, to bolster revenues, the network could find select advertisers to promote the programs via tasteful in-programming promotion.

    I think this would be a very sustainable business model, if some other things were to change.

    -First, shows would have to be produced much more cheaply, or take better advantage of technologies that allow them to do more with less
    -Second licensing fees from studios and the reliance on syndication revenue would have to be rethought. Maybe the plan would be to cross-over to network television if the buzz is pretty strong. Shows like Dexter and Curb Your Enthusiasm have done pretty well as they have crossed over from premium networks to network television. I think Fringe could do well in this regard.

    I think this model could solve a lot of the problems we see with serialized television and Fringe in particular. Shows would be directly responsible to the fans rather than networks, so they would take more risks and make stories much leaner and satisfying.

    We also wouldn’t have to live under constant threat of cancellation. Shows could be provided a 2 season grace period and if they didn’t perform receive a satisfying send off and make room for other programs. Fans would vote with their wallets if they feel a show was going off the rails.

    Studios would also have incentives to tap into additional revenue streams more aggressively and employ transmedia storytelling techniques like comics and games to drive revenue and buzz.

    If someone from Netflix and the studios are reading this post, feel free to steal my idea. Fringe Bloggers readers, what do you think about this idea?

    Darth Kate, Dylan, that’s what you call constructive criticism. If you’re not willing to engage in it, please don’t dismiss others who wish you would.

    Well-loved. Like: Thumb up 16

    • Darth Kate says

      “Your rationale that your self-professed love for Fringe’s past glories is no longer an adequate explanation for your behavior.”

      You have no idea how much i loved this show. I don’t know what other kind of explanation you want from me. I’m not “wasting my time” by spending one hour a week watching it, no matter how bad it gets.

      Also, this: “I am more forgiving of the show’s missteps because I recognize the challenges faced by producers and writers on the show”

      I’m not. plain and simple. You assume that i am unaware of how the business works and what kind of pressure the networks employ, which is a mistake. I’m not so naive as to think that there aren’t other factors at play, but the fact of the matter is that (assuming your thoughts about the executive mandates are true) the showrunners had a choice and i think they chose wrong. At this point I would have preferred that the show stuck to its guns and gotten cancelled early, without any kind of conclusion, than see it flounder on till the end by caving to those stupid executive mandates. they’re clearly not actually doing the show any good because ratings have not improved one bit and the show’s quality has suffered severely in the meantime. Also, the showrunners should come out and say that that’s what happened rather than trying to act like they’re a pair of creative geniuses who have tapped into the deepest reaches of humanity through their show. That’s part of the reason i can’t stand to watch any of pinkner and wyman’s interviews. I know how unrealistic tit is for me to want that, but just the tiniest bit of sincerity from them would be nice. and people on this site can defend every misstep in the show till it ends, but the fact of the matter is the audience is still dwindling, and from where i stand the reason why is perfectly clear.

      Also, in a number of past threads i have mentioned my concerns over the popularity of shows like jersey shore and american idol. That’s because i know that television is a market like any other which is driven by consumers, so as a consumer i choose only to watch shows which in think bear a certain level of artistic integrity, as you might put it. I do this because its the only thing i can do. We are a niche audience. We always have been, and we always will be. I don’t know which generation you fall under, but i can tell you that in terms of taste, mine is pretty hopeless. My peers are the ones responsible for making twilight and jersey shore into nation-wide phenomena. The collective taste in entertainment in american society has probably reached its biggest dip ever. your calls for a re-invention of the market are sensible from that perspective and i agree that a lot of the changes you suggest would be beneficial, but it is not going to happen any time soon and there’s nothing we can do about it besides show support for the niche shows that we like. So no matter how bad fringe gets i will still watch it, simply for the sake of the great show that it used to be.

      Like: Thumb up 7

    • Dylan says

      Constructive criticism is demanding someone to justify their opinion (emphasis on ‘opinion’, rather than ‘argument’)? And justify your own objective to purge all opinions that are contrary to your own?

      Such a lovely defamation post, truly.

      I won’t justify any of this. I will simply state that I, for one, have never made a post specifically designed to target users and question their presence on this blogging website (reason I don’t is because it’s not right, and it is in conflict with the comment policy – I, for one, perceive this to be a personal attack).

      I am here, deal with it.

      I am not going anywhere until the end of the season, and only if I perceive the show to be incapable of improving (I explained this more than a month ago). I have already explained my opinion on this season, as I am entitled to do (you may not like my opinion, but it is not your decision to make whether or not it and me remain on this website).

      So, congratulations; you have returned this stupid ‘negative vs positive’ issue back to what it was a few months ago, when people were attacking each other rather than arguing their points.

      Like: Thumb up 5

      • says

        “Such a lovely defamation post, truly.”

        I think you have hurt your reputation all on your own, with little repect for other peoples opinion. FJ has not made any slanderous statements.

        Like: Thumb up 5

        • Dylan says

          Betty, I always have such a wondrous time talking with you. And while I type this, reading over the comment policy above and its “no views of hatred or personal attacks”, I feel a sense of comfort inside – knowing that at least one of us truly understands what the concept of ‘respect’ actually means.

          Like: Thumb up 2

    • shidey17 says

      Here’s my take on this – and this isn’t directed to anyone in particular. I think this is the same as loving a sports team. You cheer for then when you’re great and are proud to be a fan. Then maybe they have a rebuilding year or two. They’re not very good. So you cheer and shout and yell from the sidelines until you’re frustrated. Then you criticize and maybe you’re not as proud to be a fan anymore. But you love them anyway. They’re your team. Always have been. Always will be. So you accept that maybe this year they’re just gonna suck. And then you get all dressed up and put on your fan gear and cheer them on to make the losing a little less painful.

      Hot debate. What do you think? Thumb up 9

  41. J.P. says

    Well, that was a long and painful detour…

    Firstly, the reason I’m posting a bit late is because, to be completely honest, the 200+ comments this page already has scared me away. But, I would like to share my opinions on this episode nonetheless, so here I am.

    As I said above, this episode has made all of season four look like a detour off the right path, and finally we’re back to where we ended season three with… a romance. Yay. I really don’t care if Olivia and Peter end up together, I just want to Peter to make up his mind. “You’re mine”, “you’re not mine”, “you’re mine”… I’m sure I wasn’t the only one who was annoyed with that.

    Also, I felt that this episode, like many others this season, was way too overhyped, and actually quite underwhelming. I didn’t find it to be at all the “fantastic episode that we can’t miss”. I found it to be just like any other episode this season — boring and without a clear focus. The only thing that “saved” the episode for me was Peter’s investigation into the Observers, which itself was not what I had hoped.

    I hated the look on Lincoln’s face whenever he stared at Olivia this episode — like a puppy staring at its mother, or in this case, like a stalker staring at its crush. It was ridiculous, and it’s just another reason I can’t stand the character, nor can I accept the idea of another Olivia-Peter relationship, because Lincoln’s always gonna be there to step in the way.

    Also, I thought the villain was tremendously boring. They’d called him “one of Fringe’s most terrifying villains”, making me very excited to see what Michael Massee would do with the role. Sadly, I didn’t enjoy it at all. I found him to be anything but terrifying, even with those scars all over his face. Usually, Fringe does a good job in explaining the motives behind the villain, but this episode did not. All we know is that he gazes deeply into a picture of a woman — but who is she? A past lover, or someone he stalks? If it’s the former, then the villain could have been more sympathetic, if it’s the latter, then the villain would be more “terrifying”. But we’ll never know. And also, what exactly was his goal? He was targetting love in order to make sure everyone “got to experience love”? How? Was he going to distribute those pheremones worldwide to make people fall in love? If the writers had elaborated on his plot, then maybe I would have understood him much more, or been more “terrified” of him.

    And another thought — the final scene with Olivia and Nina, when Olivia’s “funeral theme” began playing, made me curious. This makes me wonder if September’s warning, “you have to die”, is not in fact a literal one, but a figurative one. He gave that warning to the “amber Olivia”, and this scene, at least to me, indicated that very soon, the amber Olivia will “die”, and be fully replaced with the “blue Olivia”. Perhaps that’s what September meant… ? I’m wondering if Peter’s going to dose the entire Fringe Division with cortexiphan, to make them all remember him the way Olivia is, and that’s one of the two things keeping me interested. How they will remember Peter, and what Jones wants.

    Hopefully these next seven episodes will be all the producers have claimed them to be. I can’t say I trust their word right now, but of course, I’ll watch it to the end, even if I can’t watch it the same way I watched Fringe before.

    Like: Thumb up 6

    • Dylan says

      I felt there was a presence missing, glad to see you made it onto this page in the end.

      I hope the same, and feel the same. Let’s see how these next seven episodes go.

      Like: Thumb up 2

  42. willg says

    I did not find the love thing a cop out at all. Love does crazy things to people all over the world and it has been established already in episodes like 6B that it can be interdimensional as well. Perhaps people would have preferred an explanation like molecular entanglement due to this electron or that proton. Tell me that would not be contrived and somewhat ridiculous. This love theme has played out in other shows as well like Lost. There is a reason for that. There is nothing more important in our lives than our relationships; our relationship with our significant others, our children, our spouses and of course for many God. The love and emotions dealing with these relationships seem to be more powerful than a covalent bond. I think that is the way it is played on these shows because it makes sense. Any scientific explanation trying to deal with these powerful relationships would seem just as much a cop out as others believe the Love issue does. Just my 2 cents.

    Hot debate. What do you think? Thumb up 9

  43. Tash says

    Was that what the observer meant about her dying because if all the alt-timeline-livs memories all got replaced then effectively she died
    Plus that lincoln guy is starting to get a bit annoying its like-
    Walter- son dies of a horrible illness, wife commit sucide and is instutionilized for 17 years
    Peter- kidnapped from another universe,mum commits sucide, is connected to a machine that could end the world, ceases to exsist and then is forgotton by everyone he loves
    Olivia- experimented on and abused as a child, lost two partners in the same number of years, nearly died in the car accident, keeps being expected to save the world with jedi mind shit, gets kidnapped and replaced
    Lincoln- ME TOO!! ME TOO!! I GOT A HEADACHE THE OTHER DAY AND WALKED INTO A WINDOW!!!

    Like: Thumb up 2

    • Dylan says

      You just reminded me of something.

      If this really is the same universe after all, then hopefully they can explain to us how exactly the machine is both present and managed to function (and in turn, who created the bridge – if not Peter).

      They have a few more things yet to explain. Hopefully they make these next seven episodes count.

      Like: Thumb up 2

  44. Liz says

    Great episode, for P/O shippers (btw I’m big P/O shippers), but this is Fringe, there is no happy ending, so yeah, O/L shippers probably will also be happy at the end, why? Well, this is just my theory: we already know that producers don’t leave something in episode just because… they leave it with reason, so all this L/O stuff, as annoying as is it, is here with reason. And that reason is that at the end Peter MUST be delete, or somehow in non existence, and Lincoln is here as second best (safeguard). On what I base my guess: well, in one interview W. when asked about L/O, said “But if he (L.) was given the chance, if Peter wasn’t there, if there was another way and Peter would not interfere with what Lincoln feels that they had the beginnings of… ” , so in my another viewing of Novation episode, at end, when Olivia had that strange “time leap”, just when she asked Linc to go with her to dinner, and he said no, what if this was place when two different realties could go: in one where Peter is back and what we have is now, and other where Peter isn’t relevant somehow and Olivia starts relationships with Linc – because from that point they could go there. So maybe, Peter knows that (he certain knows about Lin and his affection to O., after all Peter gave his blessing to pursue O.), and he knows that he must be in non existence, but he wants leave O. with someone who love her, and who she”ll eventually start love. So in the end of this “love” stuff, there is no happy end for Peter and Olive. This is one way to end this. As for Walter, this is MAIN story I want to be explore more in last episode of this season/series. So bring in on.

    Like: Thumb up 2

  45. Cortexiphan Kid says

    Does anyone else thinks, that this week’s case sounds a lot like Patrick Suskind’s novel Perfume: The Story of a Murderer?
    The book is about perfume apprentice, that is trying to create the perfect perfume by extracting smell from beautiful virgins, because he want’s to be loved.

    Also, movie with the same title was filmed in 2006.

    P.S. Sorry, if my english sucks.

    Like: Thumb up 1

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