FRINGE: 4.07 Wallflower

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When a man mysteriously dies by an invisible force, his body rapidly begins turning ghostly white. The Fringe team learns that this is not an isolated incident, and there’s evidence that links the predator to someone who passed away with an unknown genetic disorder. Meanwhile, Olivia (Anna Torv) suffers from migraines.

Wallflower Sneak Peeks

Fringe 4.07 "Wallflower" Ratings

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  1. Sean says

    Having fun so far! I know it’s not meant to be the finale, but I’m hoping it’ll end on a really strong note!

    Like: Thumb up 2

  2. hal says

    I think this episode made me realize how much I don’t care about these alt-time characters..
    And it was pretty meh for a standalone..

    at least it had some kind of cliffhanger for us, even tho it wasnt really going to be the winter finale..

    Well-loved. Like: Thumb up 16

  3. didipuffs says

    No scenes with Walter/Peter.. Peter walks past Olivia with a “hi”? WTF? If the writers want the fans to feel disconnected, mission accomplished.

    Well-loved. Like: Thumb up 19

    • Amanda says

      The writers want the fans to see that Peter feels like this is not his timeline. If they show all the scenes with Peter and Walter bonding or Peter and Olivia bonding, you forget that this isn’t where he should be. They want to keep us focused on the fact that he still is trying to get home.

      Well-loved. Like: Thumb up 21

      • number six says

        They should have focused on Peter trying to get home if that was what they wanted. They gave him 3 completely irrelevant short scenes, which makes me think they care very little if at all.

        Well-loved. Like: Thumb up 12

      • Dylan says

        You would think that Peter would begin by spilling the beans on big Fringe elements such as the Observers, instead of busying himself with getting agent Lee some new glasses.

        Like: Thumb up 7

        • says

          I addressed that in my first post. Peter is a treasure trove of top secret confidential information about EVERYBODY Over here AND Over There. Yet, he is the only “Fringe Event” no one is investigating. Yeah we had some great scenes of Walter poking and prodding him, but it’s like once it was determined that he was a “real live boy”, it was back to business as usual.

          Peter mentions “The Oberserver” and Broyles doesn’t bust in the room like, ” WTH is an Observer? Who are they Observing? And what is their connection to Our Universe, and more importantly You!” Whether you’ve been watching since Season 1 or not, it takes you out of the story. Is there a real FBI agent available for a debriefing (eh, uh…hum…Special Agent Charl… oh you guys know where I’m going with this)

          Well-loved. Like: Thumb up 12

          • g33k says

            They didn’t even want him handing a toy to a random kid in a store, I don’t believe Broyles would want him to spill the beans on every secret he knows because it could do damage.

            Like: Thumb up 4

            • Dylan says

              He means spill the beans to Broyles and company.

              It’s ridiculous that Peter is even allowed out and with an allowance, after just one mission.

              If it’s this easy to deceive the Fringe division into trusting someone, then I don’t think they stand a chance…

              Like: Thumb up 2

              • FringeFriday says

                Last episode they trusted Peter with everything he had and now he isn’t even allowed to talk to civilians. I bet there are two agents in front of his apartment watching him!

                Like: Thumb up 0

      • Ann_Louise says

        Except that the whole “trying to get home” riff seemed to pop up recently. Peter was trying to reconnect with the people in this timeline, then suddenly decided that this place wasn’t home and he had to go back. My fear is that there is no “home” to return to because it’s the fusion of the red and blue universes. These strangers who couldn’t care less what happens to Peter are the people he’s stuck with.

        Like: Thumb up 3

  4. Pwnsauce says

    This episode’s case was worse than last week’s, and it felt pretty weak, but the ending and promo for January and post winter lowatus have definitely piqued my interests. It’s good to see our old friend Sinister Nina back in action.

    The glyph spelled ‘David’ which I’m assuming is for our dear old friend.

    Hot debate. What do you think? Thumb up 8

    • FringeFriday says

      I honestly thought he was the one closing the door in the last scene… or at least i HOPED! that would have been a nice cliffhanger!

      Like: Thumb up 1

    • alexis says

      that ending… i’m going to go nuts til january!! it works as a cliffhanger for me… the episode was definitely weaker than desirable for a fall finale, but the ending was pretty rad! hope we get to see more of untrustworthy nina the rest of the season!

      Like: Thumb up 6

  5. djy2500 says

    Not a very good ep., but preview for january looked bada**! Can’t wait! In the mean, I will be proceeding in my third consecutive run through of the series on bluray.

    Like: Thumb up 4

  6. Schwakamole says

    I knew it! Nina-kins still has some tricks up her sleeve.

    Those were some sweet promo scenes. Thank goodness the holidays go by fast and we’ll be at January in no time.

    Like: Thumb up 6

    • FringeFriday says

      Ever since Olivia asked about Ugen/Ugene (or how he is spelled) I saw it in Nina’s face that something was wrong.

      Like: Thumb up 5

  7. Ben says

    Most of the episode I thought was kinda bland. I just can’t bring myself to care about Olivia with Lincoln, even if Peter gives them his blessing. But the ending kicked it up a letter grade for me. Good ol’ Nina with her dark moral ambiguity saved it.

    Well-loved. Like: Thumb up 12

  8. T says

    Ok, I’m trying to be patient…but that was without a doubt the WORST episode since Fringe started!

    How did it advance the storyline? We now know Peter is working on the machine (of course he’s working on the machine…would we expect anything else?) and Nina is the same old Nina we know and love (doesn’t advance the story but is interesting. THAT WAS IT! The rest was just filler.

    The #1 mystery for Fringe is the alternate universe and BBM. All of a sudden you get Walter’s son from a different time line who has an intimate connection with the BBM and the Fringe team is out working on the case of a disappearing man?! ARE YOU KIDDING ME?!

    I realize this was not meant to be the fall finale, but man it was bad. There was no interaction between Peter and Walter/Olivia! A show doesn’t exist without interaction between Peter and Walter/Olivia…hence the pointless nature of this episode. And don’t get me started on Lincoln.

    Ok, I’ve vented my frustrations. Hope future episodes are better.

    Well-loved. Like: Thumb up 44

        • JM says

          Episode 8 and 9 are supposed to be amazing, we all have to hold out hope a little longer, that hope will not stop me from absoloutely blasting episode 7 though, i swear they have a very different writing team this season i think they should be fired lol get the old ones back! but keep david fury!

          Hot debate. What do you think? Thumb up 8

    • DARTH SIMOUS says

      Since it has been a while, since i last posted, i will give it a go. I too agree it was one of the worst episodes so far (gave it a 3). Don’t the writers hear most of us fans NOT “loving” the whole Link-Olivia thing? And now Peter giving Link an “Alternative” set of glasses? Seriously, WTF? As most hardcore Fringsters, i am gonna follow the show to the end, doesn’t mean i like what i have seen on S4 so far, apart from episode 6, which was indeed brilliant,IMO. To J.J. and the rest of the gang: STOP MESSING with the show and fix things! Being revealed quite while ago that Peter is trying to return to Blue-Verse for some time now, diminishes this 8-Episode Yellow-Verse to a very low level, i think. And judging from Episode 8 Promo, they will try to fix things with a single strong episode? I don’t think so…Please people, give us more Observers, Charlie and ofcource “the Oracle”, ahem Sam Weiss, enough with this Link & Olivia nonsence. There, took ‘em out of my chest!

      Like: Thumb up 7

      • says

        You put it perfectly. I’m having a hard time caring about an Olivia, Walter and even Astrid that don’t know Peter and that he knows aren’t *his* Olivia, Walter and Astrid. What are we even doing wasting time with them?

        I was actually hoping that Peter could make some sort of connection with THIS Olivia. Last week, when he asked her about what they were doing when she dreamed about him, I was hoping she would admit that they were together in her dreams. Something…anything!

        After all, Peter connected with Bolivia/Fauxlivia…why couldn’t he also connect with this Olivia?

        Oh well…looking forward to January, because I will never give up on this show!

        Like: Thumb up 7

        • DARTH SIMOUS says

          Spot on. When Olivia said something like “Why would i feel anything? You are a stranger…”, immediatelly i thought “people are usually strangers, before they start connecting emotionally or else”. What did the producers trying to say, anyway?

          Like: Thumb up 0

  9. Sofia says

    I did hate this episode. A monster of the week when they have the most epic history to work! I don’t understand what was that. Why not to do the amazing job they did last week, bringing Peter’s POV to the case, so the audience can connect to something familiar in the show. I’m in rage right now, sorry if I’m the only one…

    I love Fringe and I can’t stand they giving motive, for people lose their interest.

    Well-loved. Like: Thumb up 25

    • Niomi Lianne says

      but this guy wasnt really a monster. He was a real person who only desired simple things, I think his storyline was worth watching.

      Like: Thumb up 6

      • Schoko says

        Agreed. It helped Olivia to relate to her “disconnect” with others throughout the episode. She also was experimented on as a child, like Eugene. Plus, Eugene pulled her up, seemingly acting more like a person than a monster.
        I wonder if Nina is activating Olivia, like Isaac Winters.

        Like: Thumb up 7

        • Sofia says

          Guys, don’t be too literal. I’m not calling the guy a monster. Monster of the week is a term just like case of the week, or standalone episode.

          Like: Thumb up 4

      • says

        I agree, Niomi. He kind of broke my heart. And I get that they were trying to send a message about “seeing.” Ugene wanted people to “see” him. Even Peter giving Linc the new glasses fit in with the theme of “seeing.”

        Still thought there needed to be more to advance the show and the characters we love.

        Like: Thumb up 4

  10. hellrasinbrasin says

    … I wonder what was in the injection Nina Sharp’s minion gave Olive.

    Hmmm damb Baseball episode 8 would have been a killer fall finale.

    Like: Thumb up 6

  11. MISSNETT says

    At least we got a bit of a cliff hanger. It was way more than I was expecting since baseball messed everything up!

    Like: Thumb up 5

  12. Scully8 says

    I totally agree. Was the point to let us know that Olivia Lincoln are getting together? Really. . . The episode was somewhat interesting and I get the connection to olivia’s storyline, but pretty lame. The show really isn’t that great without the holy trinity.

    Lincoln, I so don’t care about and the relationship seems really forced. The chemistry bet Olivia and Peter remains strong even though he walked right past her. I could go on, but I’ll come back later.

    Well-loved. Like: Thumb up 18

    • scully8 says

      Okay, I have calmed down a bit. I still don’t think this was a great episode, but it did a good job of showing us how Olivia feels — isolated and, in a sense, untethered.

      In terms of she and Lincoln — I still don’t like it, but I don’t think it’s going to go too far. I know everyone is saying that this Olivia isn’t Peter’s Olivia, but I just can’t seem to seperate the two.

      Also, I get why Olivia would hook up with Lincoln; he’s sweet, caring and really cute, however he just lacks something . . . he doesn’t do it for me. I still think the relationship seems a bit forced on the part of the writers. I don’t care if this Olivia is more open and therefore, quicker to let someone in, but it just doesn’t feel organic.

      Finally, I wasn’t surprised by Peter’s reaction to the O/L hooke up because JJ alluded to it in a interview. However I was suprised by the ‘walk by’ Olivia with a ‘hey’. Oh well, we have lots more episodes to go and episode 8 (and I hear 9) should be awesome.

      As a die-hard romantic, I struggle to look beyond the P/O story, but baby, if episode 8 is as awesome as it looks — see ya later P/O! :-)

      Well-loved. Like: Thumb up 10

  13. KLA says

    Sad to say, but I was glad when it was over. I just did not get it. As others have said, the last scene and the promos for next year were the best parts. Nina- so glad she was in the episode. I wonder if the medicine they are giving her is to keep her from exercising her cortexifan super powers. Perhaps Nina is in co-hoots with the Observers, and is doing this to help Olivia in some twisted way.

    Well, it is lengthy breaks like this that hurt the ratings. Too bad.

    Like: Thumb up 4

  14. Damenez says

    Ok so I never hated the whole Lincoln and Olivia thing because it makes sense, this isn’t Peter’s Olivia. For all she knows he was a stranger that appeared in her dreams (and she probably still doesn’t fully understand why) and for some reason he is a fringe event. But she doesn’t feel the same way as “our” Olivia does.

    However, Lincoln is someone she’s been seeing on a day to day basis, if anything he’s the one she should be trying to build a trust and connection with.

    Also this is about her. About how she has this internal conflict of being able to allow someone else in her personal life and feel okay with it. That’s why it’s so hard for her to ask Lincoln out (same thing happened with Peter).

    + You know how Olivia asked Nina about how cortexiphran may have altered her emotional state, who knows maybe she’s right, maybe that’s why she is how she is.

    Well-loved. Like: Thumb up 13

    • FringeFriday says

      I am really too late to post today, but I understand they go down the Linc-Olivia road, it is-as you said- not Peter’s Olivia. Even Peter knows. He wouldn’t have gotten Linc new glasses if he were fighting for his Olivia. it makes sense.

      Like: Thumb up 4

      • didipuffs says

        Peter did learn a lot about Alt-Olivias and I totally understand why he is not fighting for *this* Olivia. I can remember him sitting in the garden when real Olivia told him how hurt she was. He never wants *real* Olivia to feel that way. And really what is love, but the building of history between two people? The way Walter and not-his-biological-son Peter built a love history.

        Having said all that, I still hate tonight’s episode. Focus on Peter or get him back to where he belongs QUICKER. I like Lincoln but I didn’t sign up for the Lincoln show. I signed up for my trio.

        Well-loved. Like: Thumb up 17

  15. J.P. says

    I thought this was a tremendous step DOWN from last week’s average episode. Definately the worst of the season, in my opinion. Peter was downgraded even further. He didn’t interact with anybody other than Lincoln, and Olivia so briefly. At least “Novation” allowed Peter to get involved in the case to a minimum extent, this episode only featured Peter in a couple of filler scenes. Unfortunately, those scenes, and the last minute, were the best scenes of the entire episode.

    I didn’t care for the case of the week. The acting and dialogue were bland. And great, another step forward in Olivia and Lincoln’s possible romantic relationship. The only story point you’d think the writers would be focusing on right now (getting Peter back home) was already covered in the promo — “[the machine] is my best chance at getting back home”. The only thing that prevented me from declaring this one of, if not the worst Fringe episodes ever, was the final cliffhanger. It was a very unexpected and interesting plot point, and it hopefully develops Nina’s character further.

    I had hoped that “Wallflower” would follow “The Abducted’s” format — a slight tease at the end (the phone call Peter receives, or in this case, Nina’s deception), to keep us at the edge of our seats until the next episode. And yes, it did. But, that tease seems completely unrelated to the “season’s biggest mystery”. To make matters even worse, “Back To Where You’ve Never Been” is SO FAR AWAY! And, judging by that quick promo, it’s easily this season’s greatest episode. I hate baseball so much right now — I also blame FOX. They could’ve easily skipped past the November Sweeps and aired “Back To Where You’ve Never Been” one week from now. But of course, they always have to ruin Fringe’s scheduling.

    Fringe missed a huge opportunity here. What a shame.

    Well-loved. Like: Thumb up 22

    • JM says

      @J.P
      Im currently halfway through the episode, and let me tell you the overwhelming negativity i am experiencing here, this may be the worst episode of fringe i have ever seen, the only good bit so far has been when peter is in it!

      Well-loved. Like: Thumb up 21

        • JM says

          I cant be bothered to rewrite everything i put, but needless to say this is the first time i have ever voted worst ever fringe episode on fringebloggers

          Like: Thumb up 6

          • J.P. says

            Hmm… I wish I could see your long post, but like you, I can’t?! Long story short, yes, this probably is the worst Fringe episode ever. The only reason I didn’t vote it as the worst ever is because I felt partially saved by the final shot of Nina. It’ll keep me guessing until “Back To Where You’ve Never Been” airs, so I guess that’s enough for me to give this episode SOME credit. But man… what a horrible episode. I have no idea what the writers were thinking.

            Like: Thumb up 0

            • JM says

              Basically i agreed again with everything you’ve said :L :P but in a very long winded way with some choice swear words (probably why it didnt show up lol)

              Like: Thumb up 1

  16. Peanut says

    Peter gets Linc to ditch the birth-control glasses.

    Oh no, Ninakins, you didn’t! It’s for Olive’s own good, right? I don’t remember headaches being a side effect of Cortexiphan so what is BadNina giving her adopted daughter?

    Like: Thumb up 4

  17. JanC says

    Holly cow!!! That was “Brown Betty” awful,ok maybe not but ..I’m scared for the future of this awesome show. Come on J.H.W and J.P give us our Fringe back <\3<\3

    Like: Thumb up 7

  18. megan says

    Okay episode. But a WTF moment at the end. Nina how could you!?

    The preview for January looked amazing. More Peter, Walternate, Eliznate and just the alternate universe in general. I can’t wait!!!

    Like: Thumb up 6

  19. g33k says

    Hm, I thought this episode was a clever call back to the baby Henry disappearance. If you’re against the baby storyline, you’ll probably hate this comment because its a big hint they’re not done with Henry. Commence your “Oh S**T no!” posts… now!

    Like: Thumb up 3

    • Red Balloon says

      LOL!…, great comment!…it’s not that I hate baby Henry storyline, but I’m afraid of it….I’m just not prepared for it yet, but I love Fringe’s twists

      Like: Thumb up 2

    • runthegamut says

      Here’s where I see similarities between those two things. Last year, when there were hints of a baby, I rationalized it six ways from Sunday. “They wouldn’t dare. It’s too obvious. It’s cliche. Altlivia has no enhancements like ourlivia does, so there would be nothing special about her baby. Peter and Altliv originated in the same universe, so there would be nothing special about their baby.” Etc. I was sooo disappointed when they actually went there. And now here we are, and I’ve been rationalizing not having a Lincoln/Olivia relationship the same way. “Olivia doesn’t need to get involved with every single one of her partners. The story has obviously crafted Olivia and Peter to be together. It’s too obvious. It’s cliche.” etc. Well, last night was pretty frustrating from that stand point. I don’t want to go down THAT road either. But resurrect the baby arc? Must we? That was the only bright spot about the reset for me. Maybe I should just sum up with “Oh S**t NO!”

      Like: Thumb up 6

    • g33k says

      Well, I’m in the positive camp. I liked the episode, I did find myself caring about the Orangeverse Lincoln and Olivia and was happy to see Peter drawing the distinction and be sure about this Olivia NOT being his Olivia. I think I cared about Lincoln and Olivia (separately, not specifically as a couple to ship) in this episode more than any other so far.

      Maybe I have a different perspective on what we’ve been watching, because I have a feeling I know what’s going on. Plus the more I watch, the more I see things that tend to prove the direction I think the writers are going in, so maybe that’s bias, but for me, good bias.

      Did anyone else find the Octopus cute? I never thought I would think one was cute but that one was.

      As for my baby Henry comment above, besides Olivia being experimented on, I think that was what this episode was supposed to be a parallel to. I though Eugene (David?) was so tragic, I really felt bad for him even though he went around killing and then killed again to essentially commit suicide for one moment of connection. It highlighted to me how precious simple connections are when you can’t have them. Like when Walter goes around introducing himself to people Season 1 style because he just got out of the institution.

      Anyway, I’m rambling. Thought I would post an opinion from someone who was happier on here.

      Well-loved. Like: Thumb up 21

    • Natasha says

      I’m with you, I’ve been loving this season so far. I can see why some people don’t like it though.

      Well-loved. Like: Thumb up 17

    • Red Balloon says

      Wow!, I agree @Al Briggs…My only complain is this board right now.

      I better wait for Roco’s review instead.

      Well-loved. Like: Thumb up 24

          • Fringeee says

            @Dylan & @J.P Here is post you may like:
            Kudos to those who seek to be as negative as possible.
            Those who dislike season four because Peter and Olivia aren’t together.
            Those who disliked “And Those We’ve Left Behind” because Peter’s dream wasn’t real.
            Those who post childish comments on every webpage I visit, bash the writers and want more PO bed scenes.
            Those who disliked “Wallflawer” because Olivia was about to date Lincoln.
            Shame on people who still trust the writers, still remember that Fringe is a great Sci Fi show, and are wanting whiners to stop crying on every board and thread.
            I adore shippers.

            Well-loved. Like: Thumb up 25

            • J.P. says

              @Fringeee As you’ve adressed that comment specifically to Dylan and I, I’d like to remind you that I don’t think either of us have referred to ourselves as “shippers”. Personally, I’d much rather prefer Peter/Olivia over Lincoln/Olivia, but I wouldn’t call myself a “shipper”. My complaint about the Lincoln/Olivia relationship is that it is forced, dull, and takes away from the “season’s biggest mystery”. Like Josh Jackson and Anna Torv, I felt that the Peter/Olivia relationship from the last bit of season 3 also felt slightly forced, and out of place, amongst all of Fringe’s other epic storylines. But, it makes much more sense than Lincoln/Olivia, because Peter and Olivia have been, or had been, together from the very beginning of the show. It was a payoff of the budding romance between the two the writers spent two and a half seasons developing. It took nearly two seasons for Peter and Olivia to get as close as the “amber Olivia” and “amber Lincoln” have gotten in seven short episodes.

              I don’t dislike season four because Peter and Olivia aren’t together, or because Peter’s dream wasn’t real, and I certainly don’t seek to be as negative as possible. I don’t think I post “childish comments” on all these forums, but if you disagree, then elighten me. My “negativity” comes from the fact that this season is radically different from the past three seasons I fell in love with. Before, the show was about the relationship between Olivia, Peter and Walter. All the craziness — the Pattern, shape shifters, alternate universes, were all introduced to us and explained to us via these characters. The characters are the key to the show. Can you say that this season has been about that relationship? Perhaps to the smallest extent possible. It’s reverted back to a procedural format. The largest character development — or even development in general, has been about Lincoln and Olivia’s relationship. That is my complaint.

              So, Fringeee, I am so deeply sorry for my “whining and crying”. You’re absolutely right — I should just watch the show without holding any regard to the seasons past, and insult all those who dare to enter the “negative whiner camp” because their opinion is lame and doesn’t hold any value. Silly me for actually reading into this show a little deeper, and not just viewing it with the same positive attitude all the time. Please accept my apology…

              Well-loved. Like: Thumb up 15

            • Dylan says

              Just clarifying on that post of yours. Are you quoting a shipper for fun? Or are you directing it at JP and I. Grammatically, it’s very confusing.

              Like: Thumb up 1

        • T says

          Just because some people “complain” about an episode or the direction a show is heading does not mean they are not just as big fans as people who give every new episode a 10 rating. Healthy criticism is good for any discipline or activity, including a tv show. It is not meant to undermine but to make better.

          Just because someone has some criticism regarding the show doesn’t mean they are a shipper. I personally could care less if Peter and Olivia end up together (although I will admit I do not want Olivia to end up with Lincoln…that guy has just rubbed me wrong from the get-go).

          Like: Thumb up 7

          • Fringeee says

            True.
            But there is a huge difference between constructive criticism and…Well…”whining”.

            Wallflower may not be a good episode, okay, you can criticize as much as you like, but when you say something like “Fringe is becoming boring because Lincoln dated Olivia in the episode” now, that’s Grey’s anatomy’s post I’m reading.

            I noticed a saddening difference in the Fringe Fandom this year. People just want the story to unfold and Peter and Olivia to be together. Seriously, that’s getting so frustrating.

            Well-loved. Like: Thumb up 24

            • T says

              I’m not saying there are not people out there who are whining but from what I’ve read of the comments the majority of criticism seems to be constructive. They have a problem with the way the show is heading and they have reasons for it. I’m not saying I agree with them on every point, but some points appear to be valid.

              Funny you should bring up Grey’s Anatomy. I don’t watch the show but from what little I know of it, the characters all date each other (their co-workers). I think that is a problem many of the Fringe critics here have with the direction the show SEEMS to be going. A fear that it is turning into a soap opera. There is the fear that Olivia is a bit of a work sl*t. If she dates Linc, that will be the 4th guy she’s worked with that she has hooked up with (the guy from Germany in S1, John Scott, Peter and Lincoln). I understand work relationship sometimes happen, but 4? I know you can argue different TL but that ignores the similarities of the characters the show has explored (it has explored the similarities and differences between the versions of the characters). I don’t necessarily want Peter and Olivia together. I just want Olivia to stop hooking up with co-workers before I can no longer tell the difference between Fringe and Grey’s Anatomy.

              To be fair, we cannont truely judge an episode without its context and since we have not seen the episodes have follow this one, we do not yet have a proper context. That being the case…the poll was put online and we have to judge it with the information we have available.

              Well-loved. Like: Thumb up 11

  20. T says

    How is 9 in the lead here and 10 tied for second?! Are the writers, producers, and actors’ families on here voting?

    I love Fringe as much as anybody, but come on people…let’s call a spade a spade.

    Like: Thumb up 7

    • Cody says

      Because it ended on a somewhat high note and that’s the most recent thing voters remember so they will vote maybe a 9, but it was definitely not worth a 10. This was more worth a 1-4.

      I think the writers concentrated on the stand-alone episode story more than our normal characters acting. It was all around just: blah. The only part worth watching was the end. I’m scared to see the ratings on this episode…

      Like: Thumb up 3

      • JM says

        I am scared to see the ratings for both this episode and the next one, as it is a general trend with tv shows that if the last episode was good the ratings on the next one are higher. Hopefully ari margolis can work his magic and give us some more great promotional material, the promo for episode 8 looks amazing, and has in it what has been missing in this season so far, more peter, walternate, eliznate and the alternate universe

        Like: Thumb up 2

        • JM says

          yeah i too am confused about that, if its a shit episode all the way through but has a good ending its a 9/10? :S

          Like: Thumb up 4

    • Natasha says

      Maybe, *gasp*, other people enjoyed the episode? I thought it was an excellent one therefore I voted accordingly.

      Well-loved. Like: Thumb up 27

      • g33k says

        yeah, ditto. Would appreciate it if people could watch their assumptions about what makes a good episode for other people please and thank you.

        Well-loved. Like: Thumb up 17

          • g33k says

            S’ok. Just thought I’d mention it now before the back and forth of frustration on this episode got words twisted. :-)

            Like: Thumb up 2

          • Natasha says

            It’s ok, I totally get that some people are frustrated and that it’s hard to deal with when it’s your favourite show. Emotions tend to get heightened and I’ve been there before that’s for sure.

            Like: Thumb up 5

      • T says

        I’d love to hear what made it “excellent” for you. What new information did it provide? How did it advance the storyline? How did it make you relate to the characters in this TL?

        Base on the semantics of the poll, one episode of Fringe must be classified as a 1. Don’t get me wrong…I’m not saying I’d rather watch Kitchen Nightmares over this last episode of Fringe but one episode of Fringe aired to date has to be classified as the worst episode. I realize that call is subjective but episode ratings are determined on their merit and this one just had very little.

        Again, I’d love to hear what specifically made this episode “excellent” for you.

        Like: Thumb up 3

        • g33k says

          Previously posted above so I’ll try to coles notes this for you:
          - I like the Lincoln and Olivia relationship and how its progressing. I do like these characters.
          - I like seeing the absolute definition that Peter knows this is not his Olivia, and him even giving his blessing.
          - I loved the story of Eugene and thought it could be a clue towards both Baby Henry’s possible situation (has he been invisibly watching all this time?) and Olivia’s experimentation. I’m a clue hound, I love looking for clues. Plus I thought his story was beautifully tragic.
          - I have a theory for what’s going on, events seem to support my theory and I think it makes me watch the episode differently. I don’t want to get into my theory because frankly, what if I’m right? I don’t want to spoii people. What if I’m wrong? I don’t want to take the discussion places it doesn’t need to go anyway.
          new:
          - I don’t think progressing from Peter being assigned a place to live and being watched in this episode could have been skipped for us to have his motivations for crossing over to the other side be believable enough. so I’m ok with the pacing.

          Well-loved. Like: Thumb up 14

        • Natasha says

          Does my opinion only count if I can answer those questions for you? Is it invalid if I can’t give satisfactory answers for the criteria that you’ve decided needs to be met for an episode to be enjoyed by an individual? Who made you Validator of Fringe Episode Scoring?

          To be honest I’m not that big a fan of Peter. I don’t dislike him and I do find him enjoyable, but I just don’t connect much with him and only really like his interaction with Walter and also in the past, Olivia.

          I do, however, adore Lincoln and find him completely fascinating and root-worthy, and seeing that he hasn’t been dealing with his assignment to Fringe as well as he’d tried to convince Olivia was a nice development. Olivia is my favourite character and this episode was centred around her as she wondered if there was something wrong with her emotions, and it intrigued me that Lincoln bringing up his discomfort with their work was what prompted her to think more about her own reaction to Fringe cases. And we also got some amazing Lincoln/Olivia scenes which I love to watch, even though I know she’ll eventually be with Peter again somehow.

          Plus I liked the MOTW, it was very touching and then tragic with the way it ended; he’d rather been seen once and then die, than live without anyone ever seeing him.

          You’re entitled to your opinion, but I’m entitled to mine and just because I don’t agree with you doesn’t make me less of a real fan than you. We all enjoy different aspects of the show, and that’s ok.

          Well-loved. Like: Thumb up 18

          • T says

            I asked the question in order to obtain information about why you enjoyed the episode. I’m not mocking you or your opinion. I just wanted to hear from someone who thought the episode was great; why they thought it was great. I personally thought the episode was terrible and I provided my reasons in previous posts.

            As far as episode scoring my point is simply if 1 = the worst Fringe episode (obviouslly opinion based) – not my wording, don’t we all have a least favorite episode? I rated wallflower a 1 because I think it is the worst Fringe episode I have seen. I still enjoyed it – it’s Fringe! But the comparison (based on the wording of the poll) is other Fringe episodes. Now an argument against that would be I don’t think the owner of the poll follows that logic considering to my knowlege he has never rated an episode a 1 (I could be wrong on that).

            Like: Thumb up 0

            • Red Balloon says

              While I was reading your post, I had a thought: This two ratings (1 and 10) are contrived because until Fringe is over, you can determine which one was the worst ever or the best ever…don’t you agree?

              I think this ratings should be saved for the end of the series, not between:
              1 Doom! Worst EVER Fringe Episode!!
              10 Boom! Best EVER Fringe Episode!

              Nevertheless….68% of this episode ratings are between 7 and 10…so most voters are considering it not that bad of an episode.

              Like: Thumb up 0

              • T says

                Absolutely. No episodes can ultimetely be rated until the show is over (in order to get full context). Until that time however we have to rate based on the information we have. Each new episode may change the way we have rated previous episodes because Fringe episodes are the basis for comparison. I think that is ok. For example, I may have rated an episode a 10 last season that I no longer hold as a 10 because another episode has come along that I think was better.

                Like: Thumb up 0

  21. williamreturns says

    I thought it was a good ep., sad, but good! I unlike everyone, I guess, want Peter to stay in this timeline. Olivia said in the first few eps. about the “hole in her life”, and Olivia and Walter are sad, they need him! (But I also like her with Lincoln, so I am torn. I always hoped that alt-Liv and alt-Lincoln would end up together.) But I don’t want Peter to leave! I feel like this is our Olivia, and I love her more than anything, I want her to be happy!

    Well-loved. Like: Thumb up 22

    • Natasha says

      I like bot P/O and O/L as well, so I win either way, heh. And I want Olivia to be happy as well, she always gets screwed over not matter what timeline we’re in.

      Well-loved. Like: Thumb up 20

  22. Dylan says

    There were several moments throughout this episode that just took me right out of it, such as Olivia’s almost falling down a perfectly square, unexplained passage through the building, Olivia’s hypothesis on the motivations of the suspect which came out of nowhere, Peter’s bodyguard/warden disappearing half-way through the episode, the fact that the suspect ended up looking and acting like an Observer with hair, etc.

    This was definitely one of those filler episodes that’s just full of expository dialogue that ultimately will mean nothing by the end of this little saga.

    Well, now all that’s left is to wait until January – two months away…

    Like: Thumb up 3

  23. AltGrav says

    About the whole dating thing: I think I know what’s going on! I think Fringe is on a direction to another love triangle story:(. Now Peter believes that this Olivia is not his Olivia but somehow he wanted her to be happy so he tried in this episode to support a relationship between Lincoln and Olivia (The glasses). I’m guessing in next episodes things will start to change and it will turn out that this Olivia is actually Peter’s Olivia and so love triangle will be back!

    Like: Thumb up 3

    • AltGrav says

      I believe this is the direction for the show because if old timeline still exists and Peter is going back to that timeline say after like half a season it means for a majority of fans that the producers just waste their time for half of the season and I personally believe that such a story is pretty lame and not worth to follow!

      Like: Thumb up 3

  24. says

    This episode was great background noise. I audibly gagged when Olivia sat with Lincoln at the diner, and again when she said she might catch up with him if he found himself awake at 3am. Ugh, Ugh, and Ugh! If anyone has to come down with a case of “close quarters” syndrome, I’d take Astrid and [insert anyone] over this nonsense.

    The Promos at least have me hopeful that the second half of the season will hopefully pick up the pace, but this MotW/CotW has got to stop. It’s weak sauce and means that we have to ignore everything we know of your team up till this point for the audience to buy in.

    I’m not buying it. I don’t believe after everthing that has happened in this new timeline (despite the absence of Peter) that Broyles would not stop all investigations and focus exclusively on Peter. Nothing about what has been revealed about Broyles, or even Olivia for that matter, has convinced me that either of them wouldn’t be all over Peter like “white on rice” asking him a million questions and comparing notes. Peter from an alternate timeline shows up and knows Names, dates, places, and alternate universe (even future-verse) details and Broyles is just treating him like some middle-aged, step-son that’s decided to move back home ?! Really!

    Broyles: ” Here’s $200/wk and access to our highly top secret BBM and alternate universe bridge room for you to play around in. Just clean up after yourself…”

    Not even the black clad, red headed, HBIC Nina Sharp could *save* this episode. It was a nice cliffhanger, but one you could see coming from a mile away.

    Note to Fox and Bad Robot: Take the time during the Lowatus to go over all the footage from the second half of the year. PLEASE make all necessary edits and addendums. This show is so much better than this, and Part 1 of Seaon 4 doesn’t hold a candle to the awesomeness that was the first half of season 3.

    Good news: Soooo, production has stopped on that “other” show on “another network”, potentially freeing up Kirk Acevedo to show up not only in the Alternate universe, but possibly make his triumphant return has Charlie Francis Over Here in the new timeline. Maybe? I mean if we’re going to reboot, then let’s REALLY makeup for past wrongs and get Lincoln outta here and Charlie Francis back. Not that he’ll save Fringe from it’s tepid plotting, but it would be a step in the right direction.

    I’m not giving up, but seeing as I have not drank the spiked Slusho, I have to voice my displeasure in the pace and structure of the season so far.

    Well-loved. Like: Thumb up 12

  25. number six says

    It’s not like Fringe hasn’t had its weak cases of the week, but they usually made up for it with good writing for the main characters. Now I have no idea, what I’m watching, but this is not the Fringe I fell in love with. It seemed it was coming back the last couple of episodes, but it looks like it was just an illusion. The good thing is that the first episode back after the hiatus looks great.

    Peter was barely there and he was completely useless. Which begs the question, why did they bother bringing him back? The producers are not even faking they care about the character now.

    Walter. Thankfully he wasn’t the annoying brat from the last couple of episodes and I enjoyed his scenes and his use of cute animals to solve the case.

    Eyebrow Man, congratulations, they have effectively turned you into the male lead and into a Marty Stu, because, man, are you without any remarkable flaws. That makes you the perfect man for Olivia Sue, doesn’t it? Of course, it does!

    Olivia. I suspected this would happen, how could it not? She can’t stop herself. The moment she has a working partner, she has to fall in love with him. It’s her most outstanding character trait. The funny thing is that the writers are making fun of everything they did with Peter and Olivia down to copying supposed significant moments in Jacksonville. Which says a lot about how special those moments were… NOT! But hey, they also made a mockery of the scene with Peter holding Olivia in the Transformation, when they repeated it with Lincoln and Olivia (twice), so why not bring it further?

    The portrayal of the migraines wasn’t very good. It runs in my family. I know.

    Nina. Her appearance at the end was the best thing about this disaster, but it wasn’t enough to save the episode.

    Well-loved. Like: Thumb up 19

    • JM says

      Peter is gonna get loads of screentime in the next episode apparently dont worry. Apart from that i agree with everything you said, it may have been you who started the eyebrow man thing i dont know, but now everytime i see lincoln i really look at his eyebrows and their always moving!

      Like: Thumb up 5

      • number six says

        But you see, unless I’ve been completely wrong all this time, Peter is a main character and Joshua Jackson is the male lead. Why has he been sidelined in 2 out of the 3 episodes he’s been in so far? I understand why he had minimum screentime in his first episode back, but not this one, not after what he did in episode 6. Anyone tuning in this season would (mistakenly ?) think Seth Gabel is the lead. I rate this treatment of Peter as “weaksauce” and I’m being generous.

        I noticed the eyebrow acting with AltLincoln last season. That’s what he does all the time, press his mouth and wiggle his eyebrows. It takes me out of the moment every single time. It’s just more noticeable with Lincoln, because of the eyeglasses.

        Well-loved. Like: Thumb up 12

        • JM says

          Yeah he is supposed to be the male lead lol, tbh hes really stepped up his game this season i used to think he was an average actor but i think hes been really good this season

          Like: Thumb up 5

        • scully8 says

          I promise, I don’t mean to be negative, but the Lincoln character has never really impressed me — this Lincoln or Alt. He’s just not that interesting, although is really cute. :-)

          Please, please, please cut back on the Lincoln . . . it definitely takes me out of the moment. I will have to rewatch last night’s episode because I really couldn’t concentrate as I was so sick about the O/L thing.

          Like: Thumb up 7

    • williamreturns says

      I know migraines, mom, grandpa, grandma, uncle, myself. And while not all of the horrid symptoms were represented, Anna, in my opinion did a wonderful job with it, and Olivia is tough! She would handle it “better” than most! : )

      Well-loved. Like: Thumb up 23

      • number six says

        My sister is tough. Olivia seemed to be suffering from constipation. The scene with her getting a migraine in front of Lincoln was only fan service to the Lincoln/Olivia shippers. Migraines give some fair warning, realistically she would have taken a pill, seeing how she had the medicine right there, long before she had to turn off the light. But how, HOW else could have Eyebrow Man and Olivia had a shippy scene otherwise? Aw!

        Like: Thumb up 6

        • williamreturns says

          That scene wasn’t just about giving us a L/O moment, but to give us another glimpse that something is wrong, ultimately revealing that in the end of episode. And again, Olivia is a character, we’re supposed accept certain traits and abilities that are above “normal”. If you don’t like the L/O thing say that, don’t diss Anna. And no, migraines don’t always give a warning, they can flatten you in an instant, and again, they’re not regular migraines, it has to do with what Nina is doing to her.

          Well-loved. Like: Thumb up 34

          • scully8 says

            I love Anna; she always delivers. However, I can’t seem to seperate ‘our’ Olivia from this NT Olivia which makes it hard to think of her as a new iteration. Maybe it’s because she’s not really ‘new’ but slightly different because Peter wasn’t around. I don’t know . . .

            In any event, Anna Torv rocks!

            Well-loved. Like: Thumb up 26

    • NewT says

      Probably in episode 4.15 we’ll see little Olivia & little Lincoln hold hands in field of white tulips!
      Well I don’t care anymore because sadly for me Fringe was an awesome show that ended after a very good cliffhanger at the end of its 3rd season!

      Well-loved. Like: Thumb up 11

  26. Mancha says

    I just finished watching the epi and at the end I yelled: B**** at Nina… It sort of slipped out… I’ve never been so invested in a show like this since 10 years ago when I was obsessed with Star Trek… :)

    Hot debate. What do you think? Thumb up 8

  27. The Watcher says

    That was the most bogus episode of Fringe….I think I may stop watching and wait for the straight to DVD; the writers have packed it in this season, no correlation to the storyline they just keep finding stupid cases which take away from the cliffhanger at the end of season 3 and keep us waiting. Are the producers wanting this to be the final season of Fringe?

    Hot debate. What do you think? Thumb up 9

    • J.P. says

      “Are the producers wanting this to be the final season of Fringe?”

      It certainly seems like that, doesn’t it? I haven’t seen/read ONE interview where they’ve assured the fans they are going to end it on their own terms. They’re actually opposed to setting an end date for the show. It’s like they’re completely oblivious to the ratings difficulties we’re experiencing right now, and even worse, they’ve, whether intentionally or unintentionally, ruined the drama from the season 3 cliffhanger, and jampacked this season with too many case-of-the-week storylines. Season 1 did the same thing, but at least the cases strengthened the relationships between the THREE MAIN CHARACTERS, and actually meant something.

      Such. A. Shame.

      Like: Thumb up 6

  28. Amanda says

    I think before, in our timeline, the writers were able to cover up the weaker case of the week episodes because it still had something great as far as character development/interaction goes. They could take little detours in the story because we still deeply cared about the characters. However, since most people don’t feel attached to any of these new timeline characters, the weaker episodes are much more noticeable. Really, the only emotional investment a lot of people have is with how Peter will get home (or how the universes will get fixed…how’s that going by the way?). I just don’t think Fringe can afford these episodes at this point in the season, with so much still waiting to be answered.

    Like: Thumb up 7

    • The Watcher says

      I completely agree, moves like this from the producers/writers will only cause the show to lose viewers.

      I can’t believe that we’ll see a season 5 at this rate; expect syndication for the future and say buh bye to what was once a great show…It was great while it lasted.

      Like: Thumb up 3

      • Dylan says

        The question is, will we see the damage in the ratings? Or, like True Blood this season, will every weaker aspect be met with a climb in the ratings?

        I don’t know, but sometimes I get the impression that the majority of people out there prefer mediocrity…

        Like: Thumb up 4

  29. Mel says

    This is the episode that seals it for me. It doesn’t matter that I wasn’t that invested in the PO relationship, they have proved that the seasons 1 to 3 don’t matter anymore and that their relationship was insignificant. They are telling me I have wasted my time. Last week I had a glimmer of hope that Olivia was lying and that she did feel something in her dreams, but the truth is that she just wants in Lincoln’s pants and nothing that happened in the past seasons has any meaning. It’s just not Olivia, Walter is completely unaffected as well, it’s like a possible alternate version of his son hadn’t appeared out of thin air recently. It looks like Peter is suffering from the same syndrome as the MOTW, he is invisible to everyone. Nobody cares and they can’t wait to get rid of him. They don’t have a minimum of human curiosity.

    I’m afraid that the core relationships from the past 3 seasons are gone and I’m sorry, no matter how hard they try, just because Olivia is in love with Lincoln won’t make me accept him as Peter’s replacement, be it in Olivia’s bed or in Walter’s lab. In fact, any possibility he had to be accepted by me is gone out of the window. Unluckily for me this Lincoln Lee’s season, there will be loads more of him and I hate it. Except for the previous 2 episodes this season sucks.

    I can’t think of a worse episode. Only Nina was true to form. Awful midseason finale.

    Well-loved. Like: Thumb up 22

    • Dylan says

      I must admit that my investment has been shocked, and I really am struggling to hang on to this show.

      Normally I can last much longer, but something that these writers are doing now is really, really pulling me away from the show that I once loved and recommended.

      I would like to say that it will get better, but is the damage already done?

      Like: Thumb up 7

      • J.P. says

        I’m affraid that the damage is already done, Dylan. Look at these seven opening episodes — six of which were almost entirely about Lincoln, and all of them featured boring cases-of-the-week. This episode was on a whole different level — just plain awful. I think that’s the first episode of Fringe I’ve ever referred to like that. Up until season four, I thought I had the show figured out — I thought I understood why the producers did what they did. Now? I have absolutely no idea as to what they are thinking. Some might say that’s a good thing, because it keeps us at the edge of our seats, but I think it’s garned the exact opposite reaction: people are just sick of it, thus explaining our ratings slips.

        This episode was ALL ABOUT Lincoln and Olivia. I’m not gonna rant about my hatred for Lincoln, and growing hatred for Olivia in this comment, because everyone will come back with “but, it’s not OUR Olivia and not OUR Lincoln!” Well, if it’s not “OUR” characters, then I have to ask the obvious, what’s the point? If we all know that “OUR” characters are still out there somewhere, and we’ll get back to them soon, then why should I even bother to try and invest in this timeline?
        Also, what’s the point for creating this timeline at all? I’d understand if it was a “place of testing” for Peter, just like the Other Side tested Olivia, but thirty minutes after Peter came back in “Novation”, he acted incredibly calm, and seemed to understand everything. He’s not suffering at all. He’s not slowly “losing his mind”, like Olivia was. He’s not having hallucinations. He doesn’t care that a “version” of the woman he loves, or a “version” of the man who he’s come to call “Dad” look at him like an outsider. Now, he’s even joined the (“amber”) Olivia/Lincoln shipper boat!
        If the producers are asking us to invest in this timeline, only to take us back to the “blueverse” with Peter after eight episodes, then again, what’s the point to invest? I’m noticing incredibly obvious parallels between this arc, and the opening arc of season three. Alternate universes/alternate timelines — someone’s trapped in the wrong universe/timeline, and they have to return home. It’s like the producers are recycling all the old material (and that old material is arguably the best run on the show), but filling them with garbage episodes.

        I actually DON’T want Peter to suddenly “return to his timeline”, because I’m affraid I might actually break my rule of “never hating the show”, and declare my hatred. I’d feel completely betrayed, and then these episodes that I’ve struggled to enjoy from the beginning, will become a cop-out. I want Peter to try to return home, only to realize that this “amberverse” is his true home, and all his loved ones have chosen to forget about him. THEN Peter will know what “testing and suffering” actually means, like Olivia, as he tries to get them to remember him — as opposed to suggesting that, before dropping it after an episode. He’d also hate himself for ever trying to get Olivia and Lincoln together, in the first place.

        If there’s another reason for our drop in ratings, or what the point of this entire arc is, could somebody please let me know?

        Well-loved. Like: Thumb up 16

        • JM says

          @ J.P
          Dude! I am now going to make it my mission in this comment to make you slightly more positive!

          First of you know (as i have been very vocal about it) that i dont like lincoln or olivia in season 4, and this relationship dealy is well simply put ridiculous, but weve got to look on the positive side.

          I would say it is not a possibility but a certainity that the amberverse is the blueverse but after peter was deleted , infact if you look at the end of the promo for 4.08 you will see (or atleast i saw) the beginning of that revelation.

          Now to your bits on peter, i tried to reason before that he has a higher IQ and he would rationalise better and in interviews ive read with the showrunners they say because he seen so much “it takes a lot to freak him out” so he thinks hes in a different timeline and hes got to get back (which i believe he will find out is wrong) so he thinks he’s just ‘visiting’ i guess so he may aswell spread the love, and i guess as how he loves OUR olivia he wants all iterations of her to be happy, and he thinks that lincoln is a good fit for her (obviously he wont want altlivia to be happy) and plus hes trying to repay lincoln for being nice to him. I agree that lincoln and even olivia now have too much screen time and its confusing to me why peter has so little screentime when this is “peter’s season” but next episode looks very peter heavy and hopefully it will be for the rest of the season, again broyles, astrid and nina’s screentime was pathetic, ALTHOUGH nina now has this storyline line with NEWolivia so she’ll be in it more, and jasika nicole says their is a astrid heavy episode coming up so you have that to look forward to. Now i know what your thinking “but these arent OUR broyles, nina and astrid” but.. YOU HAVE TO HAVE FAITH, from next weeks promo i have to believe its gonna get better

          Hot debate. What do you think? Thumb up 8

          • scully8 says

            JM, I like the way you’re thinking. I too believe that the amberverse is simply the blueverse minus Peter’s existence. I also read an interview the the showrunners that said, Peter will become frustrated and scared that he won’t be able to get ‘home’ in the coming episodes. What that means, I don’t know.

            In terms of O/L, I totally hate the hook up because it doesn’t feel authentic, not even for this NewOlivia, however they are always putting obstacles and roadblocks to keep the P/O relationship to make it ultimately more gratifying when they really do come together. My hope is that the is the blueverse and Peter and NewOlivia will fall in love all over again.

            Like: Thumb up 7

            • JM says

              It just HAS to be, if peter was just gonna go home in the 8th episode what was the point of the episodes before it! and if im not mistaken that has been a major argument across this board that the first few episodes are pointless, people who say were going back to the old timeline i would disagree with were gonna see a “merge” (i remember john noble using that word) between the two timelines

              Like: Thumb up 4

              • JM says

                I should add that therefore all episodes at the beginning at the season while lacklustre (minus 4.05 and 4.06 as they were good episodes) are relevant to FRINGE as a whole, but L/O crawl into a deep dark hole and die

                Like: Thumb up 5

          • FringeFriday says

            Peter is happy now because he thinks he is in the wrong timeline and he needs to go back. He will realize in further episodes that this IS his timeline after all.

            Like: Thumb up 4

        • number six says

          My theory is that this season is completely dedicated to Lincoln and Olivia and their epic love story. That must be the reason behind the Jacksonville scene copying noted in the comments. This has become the Lincoln/Olivia show and Peter has been relegated to third wheel, what’s new? Since they love to use Peter to develop all the other characters except him – because who cares if he should going through some serious doubts and emotions, right? – and Lincoln and Olivia are the true owners of this bar now, how could they use Peter? Well, they told us he is the eyes of the audience now, his job is to direct the audience’s opinion. And what is he telling you to think? Lincoln is a perfect human being and that it’s okay for him and Olivia to be together. The audience should embrace Lincoln and his relationship with Olivia.

          When are they going to focus on what Peter should be going through? I wish I knew, but their track record tells me never.

          Like: Thumb up 7

        • NewT says

          “This episode was ALL ABOUT Lincoln and Olivia. I’m not gonna rant about my hatred for Lincoln, and growing hatred for Olivia in this comment, because everyone will come back with “but, it’s not OUR Olivia and not OUR Lincoln!” Well, if it’s not “OUR” characters, then I have to ask the obvious, what’s the point? If we all know that “OUR” characters are still out there somewhere, and we’ll get back to them soon, then why should I even bother to try and invest in this timeline?”

          You said it very nice! that’s exactly what I’m thinking. If These new timeline characters are not our beloved characters and we’re going back to old timeline with Peter eventually, why would I bother to invest in their stories. The relationship between Peter and OT Walter and Olivia is the main reason for me to love this show and to continue watching it. so why would I waste my time to watch half season of a show that completely lacks the fundamental element of my interest in that show and even worth it seems that they are just making fun of the whole last 3 seasons relationship development between Peter & Olivia. So what’s next : In episode 4.15 there is going to be a scene that little Olive & little Linc holding hands in a filed of white tulips?

          If writers main goal is to get back to the original timeline and these new timeline characters are completely different persons and are not OT characters, they should have resolve this issue and got Peter back to the original timeline sooner than this. So now that they drag this new timeline story too long, I think its better to resolve Peters story in different way than just going back to original timeline and it seems this is what writers are up to.

          Like: Thumb up 7

        • melody says

          I think Peter is wrong and this is true timeline. Otherwise why we watched the observers secenes…Most of us feeling and thinking like Peter and we want to go back home(blueverse). .Thats what the procuders wanted. If i am right first seven episodes will be make sense and I will admire procuders for the way telling the story…

          Like: Thumb up 4

  30. kidentropia says

    “1. DOOM worst ever fringe episode” is the second highest vote? wow, this must be really, really bad!!! i totally gotta watch the worst fringe episode ever! will this officially become Fringe´s “Stranger in a Strange Land”?

    Like: Thumb up 0

  31. NewT says

    From what I’ve seen in this season thus far It seems that The “Where is Peter Bishop?” question has been wrong! The correct question is “Where is Fringe?”!

    Well-loved. Like: Thumb up 20

    • NewT says

      Or instead of “Where is Peter Bishop? Is he coming back?” The real question is “Where is Fringe? Was it really renewed for another season last year?”

      Like: Thumb up 6

  32. kidentropia says

    jesus christ, what a boring episode so far. i´m only thirteen minutes in and i want it to end already :(. you know when your friends leave the town, and you stay, and then sometime later they return to visit or whatever, and you meet them for lunch or coffee? and, while you actually enjoy their company and it´s great to see them, when you start talking, it gets awkward cause, in the time, you´ve been apart from each other, everyone´s changed, each one has gone a different path and it starts to show in your personality? that´s what i feel about Fringe right now. I still love it, with all my heart. But it´s not the same.

    Well-loved. Like: Thumb up 15

  33. mlj102 says

    If I were to describe this episode in one word, it would be “dull”. I really think that pretty much says it all. I felt it was slow, of little consequence, and I didn’t really feel invested in anything that was going on. I found the whole thing to be rather reminiscent of episodes like Earthling, Dream Logic, Night of Desirable Objects, and The No-Brainer. It had its moments, but for the majority of the episode, it was less than fulfilling.

    I will say that I am surprised that, at the time of writing this comment, the second highest rating for this episode is “worst episode ever.” I don’t think I’ve ever seen that particular rating so high. Granted, it is still early in the rating process, but the general idea is still there. I certainly consider it to be one of the weaker Fringe episodes, though I disagree that it’s the worst episode ever. I still reserve that honor for Northwest Passage, followed closely by Snakehead and Immortality. However, I knew that a lot of people would be frustrated by this episode, the lack of mythology, the continued progression of a potential Lincoln/Olivia relationship. and the few token appearances by Peter.

    That said, there were moments in this episode that were promising. And, I think it was better the second time I watched it. There was some humor throughout, which is always a good thing. I found the concept of the invisible man to be intriguing, even if it really wasn’t explored in the best possible way. And I actually liked the way they wrapped up that particular story. Despite the fact that I felt disconnected with the general story throughout the episode, it did actually come together for me when he got into that elevator for the last time and had an actual conversation with the lady. I actually felt the emotion that I think they were trying to convey when she recognized him and showed how she had noticed him. That scene was a lot more powerful than I had been expecting based on the rest of the episode up to that point. I was happy for him and it actually made the earlier parts of the episode a bit more meaningful to me.

    And, of course, the ending was certainly a pleasant surprise that earned back a couple of points for this episode. I actually liked the tie in with the migraines and the fact that they were a result of Olivia being knocked out and injected with something (cortexiphan?). And the fact that it was Nina who was behind it all completely shocked me. I know I should have expected it, but I had entirely bought into the relationship they had established between Nina and Olivia in this timeline. I’m extremely curious to find out why Nina is doing this to Olivia and what the outcome will be. It’s pretty cruel coming from the person who essentially raised Olivia — I would even go so far as to say she’s the person Olivia trusts the most in this timeline. It makes me wonder what else Nina has done that Olivia has been unaware of in this timeline. In many ways, their relationship could actually work in Nina’s favor as it has resulted in Olivia being less suspicious of her than she is in the original timeline. I thought it was a brilliant twist — exactly what Fringe does so well. It made the episode feel more like a Fringe episode. I wish the rest of the episode would have had more substance, but it was things like these that kept the episode from being a complete and total failure in my opinion.

    And yes, I’m still bitter about the fact that baseball prevented us from getting the intended Fall Finale tonight. If the previews are any indication, it looks like this episode was really just the calm before the storm.

    Like: Thumb up 7

    • T says

      My guess is that Nina is injecting cortexifan into Olivia. Correct me if I’m wrong but didn’t we learn that Olivia in this TL ran away from the cortexifan trials and didn’t complete the program? I believe Nina is trying to correct that.

      Like: Thumb up 0

    • J.P. says

      I’ve always been skeptical of Nina’s motives during this season. Her talk with Walter about Peter’s return seemed odd and very out of place, and now this cliffhanger puts her on another level. Perhaps it’s because that somewhere down the road, she remembered Peter and realized the Observers corrected the timeline? And since then, she’s made it her mission to undo the damage that’s been done, and push the others to remember him as well? Maybe that’s why she prevented Olivia from meeting Lincoln, because she doesn’t want her to get distracted from Peter. Nina’s the only thing keeping me hooked in this new timeline, unfortunately.

      Like: Thumb up 1

  34. mlj102 says

    I’m sure I’m about to open a whole can of worms with this comment, and I mean no disrespect to anyone, but I do want to add that I’m rather disappointed by the general tone to the comments regarding this season. I understand that everyone has their opinions, but I have to say I think a lot of people are being a bit overdramatic about it all. I find all this talk about how Fringe has lost its touch and it just isn’t the same show anymore to be quite narrow-minded. Every show, no matter what show it is, has episodes that, for whatever reason, just aren’t very good. Every season has things that are good about it and things that are bad about it. That’s really to be expected. Yet in the comments I read here, so many people seem to be all worked up about it and making it out to be a lot worse than it really is.

    For those talking about how this season is really going downhill, I would suggest that this is really no different from any other season. In every season of Fringe, there have been some amazing episodes, some average episodes, and some not so good episodes. I remember Season 2 started out a bit slow and less than ideal and everyone was all frustrated and negative about that, but the season turned out to be really fantastic. And I would even suggest that those early episodes weren’t as bad as they were initially received. The same goes for Season 3. Despite how much people seem to love Season 3 in retrospect, at the time the episodes aired, people had no difficulty finding things to complain about.

    I agree that there have been things they could be doing better this season, and I’m not saying that this season has been without fault. There have been some very valid points that people have made in discussing some of the weaker aspects of this season. I don’t expect every single comment to be raving about how fantastic the episode was. But I do feel as if a lot of the comments are negative in the extreme and are using the complaints they have to reflect on the season as a whole, and I don’t think that’s accurate. I don’t think I’m being overly optimistic or ignorant or blind to the areas where Fringe is weaker when I say that I just don’t think it’s as dismal and gloomy as many of the comments suggest.

    So while certainly everyone is welcome to their own opinion and to share that opinion, I would also suggest everyone just relax a bit and give the show a bit of a break as I really don’t think this season has been as awful and dreadful as many people are making it out to be. Yes, there have been negative aspects to how this season has developed so far, but I also feel like Fringe is still far from being a hopeless cause, a weak show, or past its prime. Personally, I feel Fringe has been rather consistent in quality since Season 1. It has its ups and downs, but it hasn’t dropped so low that I can see a huge decline in quality from previous seasons.

    Okay, end of rant. I apologize, but that has just really been bothering me more and more and I had to vent a bit of my frustration. Feel free to just ignore me.

    Well-loved. Like: Thumb up 49

    • williamreturns says

      I’m glad someone said it! The negativity doesn’t do anyone any good, let alone Fringe, or the ratings. I’ve never gotten mad at Fringe, I’ve cried, obsessed, and freaked out, but I am always super excited to see the next episode. And that’s what makes a great show!

      Well-loved. Like: Thumb up 28

    • JM says

      First of all:”I’m sure I’m about to open a whole can of worms with this comment” I personally would prefer to think of it as starting a reasonable debate, wouldnt you? :P and of course i understand you mean no disrespect and none is taken.

      I myself have been one of the more vocal members in the “negative camp” (is that what were calling it now? lol) and while yes I would agree that all seasons have fringe have included amazing, average and just plain bad episodes, this season (at least for me) i dont know if this is the right word but ‘obligated’ to be better as they have made such a drastic change in the dynamic of the show, and i just feel the writers have been dragging their feet, now of course i perfectly understand that you who are looking at the bigger picture of the whole season know/expect it will get better, while i am looking at the here and now, and having watched every single episode of fringe more than once i can tell you it is my honest opinion that “wallflower” was worse than “snakehead” and worse than “brown betty” and worse than any other fringe episode i have ever seen, now thats only my opinion so feel free to disagree but thats how i feel and thats how i voted.

      It seems to me that the writers feel they need to get to say episode 8 to actually start the season because else the cliffhanger would have meant nothing, i agree with that to an extent but do we really have to fill those episodes with poor quality standalones such as “alone in the world” and now the truly abysmal “wallflower”, and as stated in interviews we are supposed to be seeing the world through peters eyes, which is fairly difficult to do when he is in 3 scenes in an episode. Now I am just as much in love with eyebrow man as the next guy, but c’mon really? where the hell is charlie francis! I dont mean to be “overdramatic” but am just trying to get my strong feelings about the season so far across, i try not to be narrow minded but the long wait between episodes this season has been awful and allows negativity to really seep in and comes out in comments posted on this blog and i apologise for that.

      Now ive seen some people above say people complaing about the lincoln/olivia situation are purely shippers. I would disagree I think its a bad story arc period, and as I have stated before anna torv and seth gabel look related and i find it disturbing.

      My final point on this season: Much to my confusion and annoyance, Anna Torv no longer does it for me as lead actress she just irritates me and i dont know why, i really hope the feeling goes away soon, and frankly i’d rather have kirk acevedo than seth gabel (no offence to LL lovers)

      End of rant. Peace Out :P

      Well-loved. Like: Thumb up 10

      • williamreturns says

        But Kirk left to do another show, you can’t blame Fringe for “filling” in. I won’t touch the Anna comment, I believe her to be a god, so we’ll have to agree to disagree :), Respectively.
        I like this “reasonable debate” idea, it’s much nicer than what’s happening above us. :)

        Well-loved. Like: Thumb up 27

    • Dylan says

      “I understand that everyone has their opinions”

      And it’s best to leave it at that. It’s not necessary, nor is appropriate, to create a standard for all opinions.

      Let the negatives join the negatives, and the positives join the positives. As long as they’re in each of their camps, everybody is happy.

      Like: Thumb up 5

    • grace says

      Indeed I hope (and I believe) that from the next episode this season will be as good as the second half of season two and the first half of season three.

      Like: Thumb up 2

    • Lalla says

      Well put. I was really surprised myself by the reactions of people to this episode that thought was probably not great but okay. I think I’m not allowed to say that this characters have become old friends to me because this season characters are kind of new ones, but I always enjoy having them on my screen and I always find something interesting about them even in the dull episodes.
      I have disagreed with the writers many times in the past but the show has never betrayed my trust. It keeps being smart and interesting and keeps posing new questions and showing new angles. I’m in for the ride. Can’t wait to see where they are taking us! :)

      Like: Thumb up 6

    • scully8 says

      Thank you, mlj102 for your thoughtful comment.

      I admit, I haven’t loved all of the episodes, but my issue is with the P/O story, mostly because I’m a hardcore shipper and I tend to focus on that aspect of the storytelling first, than the overall episode’s story.
      I think there has been some wonderful storytelling (“Octoer”, “Alone in the World,” “Subject 9″ & last week’s). So, of course, the episodes that feature Lincoln drive me crazy, but I believe I’m still able to appreciate the show at large. I have to rewatch last night’s episode because I was so outdone with the L/O storyline that I wasn’t able to concentrate on the entire episode.

      However, I was really moved by the scene in the elevator — he just wanted to be noticed and loved; I think that’s exactly what Olivia is feeling these days. I also think that these feelings for her are coming up because of the sudden appearance of Peter.

      mlj, I always look forward to your comments.

      Like: Thumb up 2

    • Pwnsauce says

      I think a lot of the negativity comes from the extremely high bar Fringe set once the second half of Season 2 started. ‘And those We’ve Left Behind’ last week was a much better standalone than a lot of previous episodes in the series while ‘Wallflower’ did not deliver to the same degree, but to me, Fringe has outgrown these one-off cases of the week. From Jacksonville to Entrada, Fringe proved that it works best as a mythology arc-based show, but they seem to have reverted to waiting between multiple episodes to address any overarching story bits, very similar to the gap between New Day, Momentum Deferred, and Grey Matters.

      Advancing character storylines by themselves on the side of a random case is not the most effective way. The best Fringe episodes have come when character development results from overarching mythology. I think a lot of us don’t want to see Fringe taking steps backwards. Every episode of Fringe is still great TV, and I’m sure everyone on this site would agree that they’d rather watch a ‘bad’ episode of Fringe than a standard procedural CSI episode. I think negativity and uncertainty is an ok reaction for a lot of us, but I also don’t think it’s a good enough reason to jump ship. We’ve all invested in the first three seasons, and the writers have said that at this point, the audience is similar to Peter, in that like him, we want those past three seasons and relationships to pay off and mean something. I know we’ll get there, but at the same time, they are definitely going too slowly. I think we’re all complaining about a great show just being good.

      Hopefully I didn’t repeat a bunch of things in there and hopefully it all makes sense.

      Like: Thumb up 7

      • kidentropia says

        @Pwnsauce: you´ve nailed it. you´ve totally nailed it. I know people don´t want to hear negative things about the things they love; i don´t, either. But, for some of us, this season has not been satisfying; for various reasons, too complex to properly discuss here. I really like your comment, specially because you´re perfectly summarizing what us “Season 4 doubters” (i´m giving us an extraofficial name!) dislike about the show right now. And of course i´m gonna watch Fringe until the very end, and i´ll support it in which ever way i possibly can (i´m getting the Season 3 DVD boxset in January!), but yeah, after three years of brilliant storytelling, the way season 4 has been unfolding is a little too slow and too insecure for some of us. And maybe the writers/producers have a very clear path set for this season and, yes, maybe there´s going to be a glorious, mindblowing resolution, but right now i´m very, very skeptical. The ending was unquestionably shocking, but like many have said, not absolutely surprising. [******LOST SEASON 6 SPOILERS*****] Season 4 so far kinda makes me feel like the sideways universe in the season 6 of Lost. there are great ideas, there are intriguing possibilities, but: 1) if this is a “transient” iteration of the characters, how much should i invest? (which is somehow a lesser issue considering my next one), 2) the execution of this season storylines has been subpar when you consider the brilliant arc of Seasons 1-3.
        I´ll wait, in any case. I´m sure we all will.

        Like: Thumb up 3

      • Dylan says

        “very similar to the gap between New Day, Momentum Deferred, and Grey Matters”

        but that of course was the most reviled period of the series, critically and in the ratings.

        To think that repeating it is a good idea…

        Like: Thumb up 1

  35. vlada_vvv says

    This was an amazing episode. And personally, I thought it was great for a season finale.

    NINA has proven for the 100000th time that she IS the HBIC of the show. I loved every minute with her.

    Well-loved. Like: Thumb up 21

  36. grace says

    Not a great episode and a bad fall finale. The scenes between Nina and Olivia and the final twist made this episode, although it was not unexpected.
    The promo for the next episode has lifted my mood.

    Well-loved. Like: Thumb up 12

  37. Dessy says

    Ugh. Sometimes I really hate Fox. This wasn’t supposed to be the fall finale. I mean, why didn’t they just simply add next week’s episode? It’s not like they have something better to air next week! People are complaining about this episode being kind of anticlimatic for a fall finale, but that’s because it wasn’t supposed to be. The fall finale, that is. Making THIS the fall finale instead of the next (awesome looking) episode was like making The Abducted the Season 3 fall finale instead of Marionette. Good episodes, but just simple Case of The Week, not moving forward episodes. Fox screwed everything up for reasons I still don’t really understand.
    Also, Death to That Awful Lincoln/Olivia storyline.

    Like: Thumb up 4

      • Dessy says

        I know that Marionette was the mid season finale last season.
        I’m saying that the way they made a normal case of the week episode ‘Wallflower’ the fall finale this year is like if they had made ‘The Abducted’ last year’s fall Finale.

        Like: Thumb up 1

  38. FringeFriday says

    I wonder why almost everyone hated the episode.
    The only thing I complain about is the Peter-”less-er” scenes. Really??? He was on the last case and now he isn’t even allowed to speak or interact with civilians? PLEASE!!!

    Who else wished that Peter was sitting in the diner instead of Linc at the beginning?
    I get they go down the Linc-Olivia road as is is not Peter’s Olivia- the one he remembers and loves.
    Lincoln Lee, if you had told me “I know you can, but you don’t need to”, I would have kicked your butt! Our Olivia would have done the same ;)

    Other than that, I loved the storyline. Eugene just wanted to be seen for once and in the end he was even remembered by his lady. What more could the guy have wished for during his last breaths?

    So this was again a very GREEN-centered episode. Green shelves, green walls, green liquid in Eugene’s lab, the Massive Dynamic logo in the office was green, even the whole room seemed to show a hint of green. The elevator in Eugene’s building was red/green. When Peter entered the Fringe HQ, the lights and computer screens were green, too.

    How cool was Walter’s trick with Yoko, the mouse? I found an error right there, when Walter holds the UV- device over Yoko he has another mouse in his left hand ; )

    I almost missed the Observer in the crowd of people…

    Nina you ******, your “own” daughter!? How could you? Did you really give her a dose of Corthexiphan there?

    Well-loved. Like: Thumb up 13

    • scully8 says

      Who else wished that Peter was sitting in the diner instead of Linc at the beginning?

      I was holding out hope — holding my breath . . . oh well. :-) I’m still hoping that Olivia will think twice when we return in January. I just think this thing with Lincoln is because Olivia is searching for something or someone to feel that hole in her life and Lincoln is the easiest option. Side Note: Why must the hole for women, always be a man? :-)

      Like: Thumb up 6

      • says

        Didn’t both Olivia and Astrid acknowledge that they kept their feelings and observations about the fringe events to themselves. Olivia even pointed out that it was weird to not talk about work realated things, even among themselves.
        I look at it as Olivia having a confidant in Lincoln, someone who she trusts and confides in about the work that they deal with on a day to day basis. I mean, you have got to unload on someone, so why not Lincoln. He understands. He gets it.

        Like: Thumb up 6

  39. epoh says

    WOW…I’m surprised at all the hate that’s been thrown around. To some extent I can understand people’s frustration with the direction the show has taken, but I feel the writers have more than proven themselves and I think fans just need to relax and let things play out.

    Personally I’m LOVING this season and I’m excited to see what they have planned for the rest of the season. I just hope that the fans don’t abandon this show when it needs them the most!

    Well-loved. Like: Thumb up 24

    • FringeFriday says

      Thank you for sharing my point of view ;)
      At the end of the season we will all say WOAH, what a great season!

      Well-loved. Like: Thumb up 14

    • Hannah says

      100% agree!!! I have loved every episode! You gotta make peter Olivia and Walter go through a lot, so when everything is righted, it’s so much sweeter. Absence makes the heart grow fonder, I can only image that a different version of the same person make the heart grow even more fonder, because loves right in front of you, but it’s just not right! I will patiently wait for whatever the writers bring me! I love fringe, any version it is.

      Well-loved. Like: Thumb up 21

    • Dylan says

      Can’t relax at the real possibility that by the time the writers decide to stop playing around the show will suddenly be pulled.

      For those of us complaining, what the writers are doing right now feels like a slap in the face for having invested in and followed the show for three seasons.

      Like: Thumb up 7

      • Pierce says

        What exactly have the writers done that’s been such an insult to their fanbase? Not put Olivia and Peter back together immediately? Not reconciled the relationship between Walter and Peter although Walter’s reluctance to accept Peter is both heartbreaking and understandable given the incredible guilt Walter feels about what he’s done.

        Peter disappeared from existence then popped back into a timeline that has no memory of him. There has to be consequences for that. We were all but told that via the character that there would be at the end of S3. This is what the writers are exploring, and they should have time to do so without the audience throwing up their hands in frustration and impatience simply because Joshua Jackson hasn’t gotten a buttload of screen time this season.

        By and large the writers have maintained a pretty consistent track record in providing their audience with emotionally satisfying episodes. Some are more mythology based, while others stand more alone and that’s okay. I believe they’ve earned our patience and trust even if we aren’t wild about every episode they put out or wish they had taken a different route with a particular episode. However, to say they’ve let their audience down because some aren’t feeling the very logical direction the show has taken…sorry, that’s simply unfair.

        Well-loved. Like: Thumb up 18

        • NewT says

          So there is no problem for new Olivia to hookup with Lincoln(A character I still can’t consider him a part of Fringe) in one month but there is a big problem for Peter back to his Olivia any soon? Of course season 4 is a slap on face for a considerable portion of fans! I love Fringe because of its 3 main original characters. I can’t accept Lincoln as a part of the show that I grown to love in the last 3 season. I’m sure that I prefer to watch our original characters story instead of wasting my time to watch Lincoln and NewOlivia constantly making fun of all our beloved original characters relationship that developed during the first 3 seasons.

          Hot debate. What do you think? Thumb up 9

          • Pierce says

            That’s assuming that Olivia and Lincoln are going to hook-up or that Peter and Olivia won’t be reunited. Neither has happened thus far, but given that this Olivia doesn’t know Peter, and perhaps doesn’t want to be a place holder for the version of her he is clearly wanting to return to, isn’t looking to involve herself emotionally. Of course, that’s all we as the audience know right now. Personally, I felt Olivia protest too much when Peter questioned if she felt anything towards him in her dreams. Personally, I believe Peter showed up in Olivia’s dreams for a reason, and feel the writers will explore that in time.I think they’ve proven that they believe that relationship is important to the narrative, and that their audience cares about it. However, just because it hasn’t all come to a resolution within the first seven episodes of the season doesn’t suggest that the writers have abandoned the original version of the characters and relationships we’ve come to know.

            As far as Lincoln goes…I suppose it comes down to a matter of taste. I like the character and believe he’s made his own unique impression since joining the Fringe team. He’s been the only one of the characters that hasn’t treated Peter like a theat. He’s acknowledged and argued for the obvious insight Peter possesses that has been a help to the division. In doing so, that hasn’t taken anything away from Peter/Josh Jackson. He remains a central part of the narrative as was proven upon his return in ‘Novation’, but even more so in ‘Those We Left Behind’.

            Whether Lincoln and Olivia get together is yet to be seen. Personally, I think the tease of that possibility is red herring, but I could be wrong. Again, we’ll have to wait and see.

            Well-loved. Like: Thumb up 15

        • Dylan says

          Three seasons of storylines, character development, etc. dropped so that the writers can explore a concept, that at the same time they are not exploring, at a point where the audience should be seeing resolution and not something tantamount to a reset.

          The writers are also delivering inconsistencies in the story, prioritizing the wrong material, and executing the majority of it in such poor fashion you would think that they were purposely setting their show up for termination.

          I have never before seen any serialized television programme, film, or book series, face its end (whether forced or natural) with such a disregard for any form of resolution.

          Look at all the dropped storylines from last season, or the seasons before. See now how they are working to resolve any of them, or justify their existence. We are seeing neither character payoff or plot development. “Peter not existing” has become “Peter existing casually in another setting”, there’s no longer any direction.

          Everything that is occurring cries diversion, and I argue that
          the show has jumped the shark several times within the previous ten episodes of seasons 4 and 3, and finally the viewership is starting to reflect that.

          Like: Thumb up 7

          • Sad says

            I agree.
            William Bell really defines Fringe for me. Tease over tease over tease and it makes no sense in the end at all.
            Does anyone remember the cliffhanger from 2.07? Ridiculous now.
            The maschine is William’s design. What???
            William financed ZTF and it’s leader (Jones) wanted to kill him. Funny.
            He worked for Walternate to “keep tabs on him” and then died without beeing any help to O/P/W.
            He comes back (3.16) for no reason. He died again. No further information or resolution to that mess called Bell.

            Like: Thumb up 5

          • Pierce says

            Three seasons of storylines, character development, etc. dropped so that the writers can explore a concept, that at the same time they are not exploring, at a point where the audience should be seeing resolution and not something tantamount to a reset.

            Do we know that the writers have dropped the storylines from the first three seasons to explore a resetting of the narrative? Are we certain that’s something they’re never going back to the original time line seven episodes in to this new season? I don’t read spoilers, so, unless there’s been confirmation that’s the direction the writers are taking the story in from here on out, no one can really say that with any certainty.

            What we do know, via the narrative is Peter is searching for a way to get back to that original timeline where all the relationship developments we’ve come to know are still in place. Shouldn’t the audience give the writers a chance to see if he can accomplish that at their own pace?

            The writers are also delivering inconsistencies in the story, prioritizing the wrong material, and executing the majority of it in such poor fashion you would think that they were purposely setting their show up for termination.

            This is pretty general, so, I’ll just ask would you mind explaining what you mean?

            I have never before seen any serialized television programme, film, or book series, face its end (whether forced or natural) with such a disregard for any form of resolution.

            Assuming this is the final season of Fringe, we are only seven episodes in to this season. It wouldn’t have made much sense for the writers to decide to erase one of their main characters from time just to have him show back up in episode one of the following season, have Peter and Olivia back in each others loving arms by episode three, and his and Walter’s relationship completely repaired by episode four. There’s no payoff or drama in that. In fact, it would have rendered Peter’s sacrifice null and void. There are no consequences to play; dangers to explore or resoltution at least to anticipate if it happens immediately.

            Someone raised the question down thread, which I believe is valid. Why can’t the audience embrace these altered versions of our characters when just a season ago, we were asked to do the very same thing with the alternate universe?

            You mentioned that the writers are prioritizing the wrong material…yet given the end of S3, introducing Peter into a timeline where he died and no one knows him is a logical story direction. And I believe they’ve done a pretty good job of showing the impact a Peterless timeline has had on our primary characters. Could there have been more Nina, Walternate, the alternate universe or heck even a glimpse of William Bell? Sure, I would have loved that as I’m sure everyone else would have, but because we haven’t doesn’t mean that what we’ve seen so far is inconsistent with what has come before or that it’s been delievered in poor fashion.

            Look at all the dropped storylines from last season, or the seasons before. See now how they are working to resolve any of them, or justify their existence. We are seeing neither character payoff or plot development. “Peter not existing” has become “Peter existing casually in another setting”, there’s no longer any direction.

            I have a difficult time believing that even the most pessimistic of this audience honestly believes the writers don’t intend to resolve the storylines they’ve created. Peter has only been back full time for three episodes. The expression things will get worse before they get better comes to mind in seeing the bridges between these characters being mended. That’s not a lack of direction, plot development or complacency, it’s a deliberate progression that may not be playing out as some including yourself may have hoped, but it’s not some spiraling irreversible mess people are writing off as all but cancelled yesterday.

            Everything that is occurring cries diversion…

            Something we agree on. ;-) I believe the whole vibe of something not quite being right that’s permeated the season so far is a diversion for the audience, and it’s intentional. The question, at least for me becomes, why? Why, if Peter was erased from the memory of our characters has he bleed through any way. Why didn’t September carry through with his assignment to erase Peter permenantly. Why did Nina really decide to foster Olivia and Rachel after their mother died? Why is she injecting Olivia in what looks to be more Cortexiphan? Why are the shapeshifters still fighting this war, and for whom? Why were Olivia and Walter having visions of Peter when he has no recollection of trying to contact them? Why does Walter fear that in acknowledging Peter he’s accepting something he shouldn’t?

            I believe all those questions will be answer this season at the writers chosen pace. I’m willing to wait…I really wish others, including yourself were too.

            Well-loved. Like: Thumb up 15

            • Dylan says

              I’m going to be frank.

              While I appreciate your response to my own, it’s far too long for me to engage in a debate with you.

              I’ll just do the neutral thing and end on the “agree to disagree” escape, because I really don’t have the energy to tackle that one.

              Don’t take this as an insult, just take it as an example of me being too tired to try.

              Like: Thumb up 2

          • Red Balloon says

            @Dylan.- I’ve always found your comments interesting and disturbing at the same time, and I also know you like to win your arguments; so in advance I’ll tell you that I have no conclusive proof of mine, but here it is:

            I see often aprox. 400,000 votes in a poll from this site…how many of them are actually commenting on this site?….I can count no more than 40 or 50 different names.

            I see often that when a favorite character didn’t have enough screen time, the votes are visceral.

            I see often that when a story isn’t developing as expected or to put it simply “in a certain way which involves a favorite character or relationship”, the votes are also visceral.

            I see often in other sites, and in this site, that fans really enjoy the freak of the week episode without any concerns about the mythology, and that all they want is to see their favorite actor or actress play and just have a new thing to comment in their tumblr or in tweet, rant about something, relax and have a good time while they let the Production resolve its own trouble with how they bring the greater story further.

            I see often that those who are being visceral take the ratings fall to their side as a proof of their state of mind.

            The ratings falling…that’s just the natural trend of any serialized show…it has always being that way and has nothing to do with how the story is developing. It’s just a given thing with some exceptions on the road of tv land.

            Right now, the ratings are dropping just the same way as they were on the first 7 episodes of season 3, and the season became better than the one before, or at least the same IMO.

            I can be objective in terms of criticizing an episode, but how can anyone be objective in terms of criticizing a season or an entire series without it even ending….that’s what I find disturbing about your comments, even though they are interesting…that’s all.

            Well-loved. Like: Thumb up 17

            • Dylan says

              That was certainly a refreshing read.

              I understand what you are saying, although my argument to one point would be that yes, declination in viewership is expected – especially in serialized programming, however, it is not the declination that is the giveaway, but the rate of declination.

              If we were to track viewership throughout the entire series, I am confident that we would see a relationship between a rise and fall in viewership and the audience and critical response to episode sagas.

              With the show’s current situation, its viewership is a thing worth discussing.

              Like: Thumb up 1

            • Dylan says

              “I can be objective in terms of criticizing an episode, but how can anyone be objective in terms of criticizing a season or an entire series without it even ending…”

              I can hypothesize (evidenced by a lot of my statements which don’t speak definitively) about the season or series as a whole, but will often only operate on past and present.

              Like: Thumb up 1

          • g33k says

            Just because you think it has been dropped doesn’t make it so. We all won’t know for sure if they have really ‘dropped’ our S1 – 3 characters until the story plays out.

            Personally, I think this S4 story its just going to add to our S1-3 characters, and then some.

            Well-loved. Like: Thumb up 11

            • Dylan says

              I would love nothing more than to be proven wrong, but understand that I am working on the present episodes – and reflecting on the season 1 plot points that were discarded (discarded because they can no longer merge naturally with the current storyline).

              Like: Thumb up 2

  40. Darth Kate says

    i think if this episode had aired second or third rather than the seventh in a long streak of procedurals then it would be received more warmly. I dont know… i actually do care about the alternate timeline characters but its the overemphasis on peter that’s been bugging me. He’s never seemed like a complete character to me so i guess i liked this one because he was barely in it. i did like Eugene’s story and the ending was boss.

    Hot debate. What do you think? Thumb up 8

  41. Page 48 says

    zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz! I thought I was burning in S1 Hell for the first 59 minutes. I felt like I should be wearing a throwback uniform for this one. Then Nina came to town, armed with masked thugs and a scowl on her face, and the last minute showed some promise. I can’t believe the number of “Best EVER Fringe episode” votes this tranquilizer is getting.

    I’m not in the camp that thinks this season is a write-off. I have no objection to the writers telling me a story, and I’m not opposed to alternate timelines being part of that story. What I do object to is episodes that stand almost completely still and, worse than that, do so without much flair.

    Well-loved. Like: Thumb up 10

  42. lafra08 says

    for me this season is so far ok but I can’t help not getting invested in this Newtimeline or Amberverse characters !!!I trust the writers and producers and find the storyline for this season interesting because it was actually the only logical result for cheating the rules of time simply there must be repercussions! so I’m ok with that we have changes because of the so called “Butterfly effect” -we have a Peterless universe and the producers said they want to examine what kind of impact Peter had on our characters how they are without him! So I guess we are actually in Ourverse and the first thought Peter had the timeline must be reset was right! And IMO our beloved characters are in this Newtimeline worse off without having Peter in their life I think maybe that’s way September didn’t ereased him completely from existens he knows it was a good choice to save Peter from drowning away in the Originaltimeline he knows our beloved characters need Peter!!! Now I miss the Original Blueverse timeline and hope Pet

    Like: Thumb up 5

  43. lafra08 says

    peter finds a way to restore things they were in the OT, for now I think that Peter will for sure not try to connect with Newlivia because he thinks this is not his Olivia and because of the lesson with Faux in the OT but on the other hand I think there was no need to let Peter be as much supportive for the Linc/Olivia relationship-I hope Linc /Olivia romance is not going unfold much -Please no MoreLove Triangels:) I ‘m so excited where the storytelling is going to take us from 4.08 on-It seems Peter is going to stay in Amberverse for a while!But we have than Altverse Walternate 2Lincs Olivia with September and a word from the producers that Great Peter Olivia staff is comming up so I can’T WAIT! Thank You for this amzing show!

    Like: Thumb up 4

  44. says

    As a standalone episode i thought it was so/so, bút: the theme was very, very powerful this week.
    Imagine, to be invisible in modern society is something that we all know or knew in our lives.
    Being there, and not getting noticed, no matter how hard you try. Amazing performance. I gave it an 8/10.

    I liked the harsher version of Nina, she’s really a corporate boss now. And that scene in the end, maybe it’s to protect Olivia for something, like a mild chemical lobotomy. Occupy Massive Dynamic, anyone? ;)

    Well-loved. Like: Thumb up 18

    • JM says

      Shet son,
      i just saw that from the masked scheduler, if im not wrong 2.87 million viewers or whatever the exact number it was is a series low in viewers? not good. not good.

      Like: Thumb up 2

  45. Schwakamole says

    Wallflower was an average CotW episode but overall I liked it. I really liked how Ugene was analgous to Peter. When the people you love don’t recognize you and treat you as a stranger you are, in essence, invisible to them. I thought the overabundance of mirrors really conveyed the point that this is a timeline that “looks” much like the one we know and love but there are some fundamental differences and this episode was just highlighting that fact. Mlj, I’m surprised, you of all people, didn’t mention all the mirrors and reflections! I thought that device was really well played, from the reflections in the pools of water on the street at the beginning, to the mirrors in Peter’s house and in the hallways as they were searching for Eugene.

    Olivia’s headaches were interesting to me. I figured there must be a larger story to it that kept me on the watch for what it might be. Had she traveled, unknowingly, to the otherside (which was the cause of her headaches in season 2). Would Sam be showing up to help her with them? What was the drug she was taking (I somehow thought maybe Nina had perscribed something to “help” her with her headaches). Seems I was not too far off the mark on that one. The final scene was satisfying and a small but needed cliffhanger. I wonder if they added that after they knew how this beginning of the season was going to play out? It’s just HIGHLY unfortunate about the timing of this fall finale. But they added a very nice promo to get us salivating for next Jan.

    I must be in a different camp from most on here regarding THIS Lincoln and THIS Olivia. The way I see it, these are different people than the ones we know and love. Olivia in this timeline is different and is NOT the same Olivia we know and love as the Dunhamnator (Roco’s pet name for her). And Peter’s bump into her in the hallway is, in my opinion, the writers’ attempt to nail that down for us. However, we do still care about Olivia in this timeline because, well, she is Olivia! So because of that I would definitely NOT want to see Peter get involved with her then leave her to return to his timeline, leaving her devastated and longing for something she can never have. Likewise, I would not want to leave her here all alone with a “hole” in life. Therefore, I find it perfectly acceptable, preferable in fact, that she get involved with Lincoln (an it seems Peter feels that way too, thus the new glasses). These two people live a life that’s totally not like what others live. Being in this line of work definitely limits your dating options. So I am for it, knowing that it will stay in this timeline. And it gives us a bit of redemption for the OT Lincoln and his unrequited love for Altlivia. At least somewhere he gets the girl. And from what it looks like in the promo, we will likely be leaving this timeline soon so they wanted to wrap up this little package so we could leave it here in peace knowing our girl would be alright.

    And Walter is kind of a jerk in this timeline so I don’t see much problem leaving him behind. He’s had a little progression and I think Olivia will help him get there to a point but overall, I’m not sad to leave this Walter here.

    I also liked how Olivia set her righteous anger on Nina (who was very squirmy) regarding their experiments on Ugene. It was analagous to her accusations against Walter in Season 1 and 2. And it set her on the road to wondering what ill effects she suffered at the hands of cortexiphan. So this Olivia will be set on a course of finding out what all this means for her and we likely won’t see the resolution to that. But it’s nice to know that she will be examining herself and what others did to her that were beyond her control.

    LOVED how Nina innocently claims that she wouldn’t know what she would be like if the girls weren’t in her life. Apparently she wouldn’t be much different! Thankfully! Nina is such an awesome bad girl that apparently maternal instincts cannot erase.

    On the bad side, Dylan I totally agree with you about the hole. Dumb. And what about octopuses (sp?) gives them amazing strength? Nothing. So why could Ugene lift her out of that dumb hole with just one hand. Also, how the heck did he get into Julie’s apartment to spread all those creepy flowers all over? He’s invisible, not able to walk through walls. But I did like the little detail that Walter shared about how Octopie (better?) make little homes for themselves, and then Ugene had all these little trinkets around (but that was still creepy). Also, the headaches, if they were truly migrains, should have been more debilitating to Olivia (like others have said).

    Overall, I definitely do not see this as the worst episode, by far, but it wasn’t the epitome of Fringe either. Again, it’s unfornate where it fell in the lineup given the World Series snafu. Had it been in it’s original spot (as mlj pointed out) I think there would be far fewer criticisms.

    Like: Thumb up 6

    • lafra08 says

      Mostly I agree with you!But I don’t think we are going back to the Originaltimeline any time soon! in the promo for 4.08 Altlivia seeing Peter asks Who the hell you are?so we are trapped with Peter in this Newtimeline:( still it will be exciting to see what is gonna happen in the Altverse, the promo is very interesting!!!!!! So missing Our
      original timeline I ‘m looking forward to Peters amazing journey Home!

      Like: Thumb up 2

    • Pierce says

      I haven’t gone back to re-watch this episodes yet, but like you, while I didn’t find it to be amongst the best episodes of Fringe, I hardly found it the worst. ‘Northwest Passage’ and ‘Immortality’ still hold that honor.

      I thought there were four key scenes in the episode that highlighted the isolation and lonliness of our main characters. The first was Peter and Timmy the agent assigned to watch him. Peter, much like Ugene is a case study, an event Broyles is keeping an a close eye on. Sure, he has his own housing, even an allowance, but he’s restricted, and by and large seen as an unwelcome prescence. Even his attempts to innocently hand a kid a toy he can’t reach is restricted and viewed as hostile. What an frustrating, isolating position to be in.

      The second was the scene between Peter and Lincoln where Peter thanks him for treating him like a human being. How disconcerting it must be to be back in the same home, around the same people who look and talk like the people you know and love, but they view and treat you as a stranger. Either by refusing to acknowledge you like Walter is doing, or politely (for the most part) rejecting you as Olivia has done.

      The third was Ugene’s conversation with Olivia about wanting to be seen, acknowledged, recognized, loved…anything to make a human connection with someone who doesn’t just see him as an experiment.

      The fourth was the conversation between Nina and Olivia. Olivia questioning if the Cortexiphan trials had stolen her ability to truly connect emotionally with people; not to mention numbed her ability to be shocked or surprised by the insanity that makes up her job.

      I thouht the scene between Ugene and the lady in the elevator was beautifully done. That desire to connect and to be looked upon with kindness, consideration and expectancy. The fact that Julie had been seeing him all along…and voiced concern that she had been anticipating his getting on the elevator each day. It was heartbreaking to see him die, but joyous that he was able to connect with someone in a meaningful way.

      While I thought it was odd that Peter brought Lincoln a new pair of glasses, I thought it was sweet that he sort of pushed him Olivia’s way. He realizes that this isn’t his Olivia. And maybe even recognizes that her standoffishness (is that a word?) towards him makes sense. That being said, I’m not really feeling a vibe between Olivia and Lincoln. It doesn’t have anything to do with Peter, because I want Peter to return to the Olivia he knew…it’s just…I don’t know, something is missing there.

      Overall, like most of you, I’m disappointed that the Fall finale ends with this episode when it was clearly not meant to. However, I’m excited for the show to return in January. Man this going to be a long break.

      Well-loved. Like: Thumb up 19

      • Pierce says

        I forgot to add my thoughts on the final scene of the episode. I can not tell you have thrilled I am to have duplicitious Nina back. She’s been sorely missed. We know that whatever she’s having Olivia injected with (Cortexiphan I assume) is causing Olivia killer headaches, but the purpose is about as clear as mud.

        My assumption about episode eight is that it will give a lot of insight in to why the first seven played out the way they did. Or, at least that’s my hope. Either way, September, Walterate, Elizabeth and Charlie are back, and as much as I hate to admit it, I’m looking foward to seeing Altlivia again, too.

        Like: Thumb up 5

    • mlj102 says

      “I’m surprised, you of all people, didn’t mention all the mirrors and reflections!”

      :) I try not to sound too much like a broken record, but since you mention it, I will say that I have been thrilled with the use of reflections this season. I know it’s trivial, but I can’t tell you how happy it makes me to see all these reflections in each episode! They have really stepped it up this season and made the reflections more prominent and more of a visual tool in highlighting the themes. As you said, this episode continued with that and had some fantastic reflections. Definitely one of the highlights of the episode. And I like your analysis that they emphasize the fact that this timeline, while similar, is not quite the same — nicely said. I’m glad that I’m not the only one to single out the reflections and their significance in episode reviews.

      Like: Thumb up 2

  46. djy2500 says

    Final thoughts. Yes, the overall episode was awful. Yes, it had some decent moments. Yes, the show is dragging right now, but consider this: If you watch as much tv as I do then there is cause for hope. This season is following a formula I have seen many times before. Big build-up for an astronomical payoff. patients people! There has never been a show on tv that every episode was dominate. You have to take the good with the bad and wait for the big picture to reveal itself then make your conclusions. Stop getting blinded by the networks terrible timing in the release of their schedule and enjoy what you have got. I fail to believe that the writers wont throw us a bone in the next couple of episodes. This show is too good for it to fall to the wayside and be lost to oblivion.

    Hot debate. What do you think? Thumb up 9

  47. Mike Mike says

    This season has been boring in my opinion. Not necessarily as compared to other shows, but compared to the standard that Fringe has set with the previous seasons.

    The relationships that we are seeing seemed forced, there doesn’t seem to be enough interest in Peter by the FBI considering he is a genetic match to Walter, knows tons of information about FBI agents, AND knows tons about Fringe events.

    The three main character acting is great, but the actors can only do so much with a story that seems to be crawling along.

    I haven’t liked this season from the beginning. I feel like that has been way to many case-of-the-week shows when there is a good story to be told.

    In fact, I thought the end of season three would’ve been a great series finale.

    Being that Fringe is on Friday night, maybe it can survive 1.1 ratings, because they don’t have much else to put on Friday. I have to question whether a show can continue with 1.1. ratings for the rest of the season though. If I am not mistaken a rerun episode of “Hells Kitchen” received 1.5 ratings right in front of Fringe.

    I really enjoy Fringe, I just haven’t enjoyed this season at all.

    I know that a lot of fans don’t like to see negative posts, this is just my opinion.

    Like: Thumb up 4

    • Dylan says

      Watching season 3 again, it always did seem like it was heading towards the end of the series.

      That’s what is so terrible about season 4; rather than seem as though we are reaching the end, we almost seem to be beginning all over again…

      Like: Thumb up 4

      • J.P. says

        Agreed. Season 3 hit the ground running with the Machine, and it’s threat to both universes, even while Olivia was trapped over there. Even if it only really got developed in the last half of the season, everybody understood where the show was going from the opening episodes. It was building towards a roaring crescendo, before the final cliffhanger. Now, it’s almost like the Machine, and three years of background information on the alternate universe, has been completely forgotten, and they’re thinking about spending another three seasons building up to a new threat. It’s a very odd decision.

        Like: Thumb up 2

  48. YourPique says

    I didn’t think it was a bad episode. I still have hope…

    Comment: The score was reminiscent of Season 1, in my opinion.

    Like: Thumb up 4

  49. Mel Duff says

    Roco and fellow posters, please help me. Olivia took her dog team up the 25th floor on the elevator, but encountered Lincoln on the 23rd floor. WTF?? Did this have something to do with the random “Money Pit” hole she fell into? The camera made a point of lingering on the 23rd floor signage. My husband and I just stared at each other blankly. I caught the 25th floor elevator stop on the rewatch.

    Like: Thumb up 0

    • g33k says

      Olivia instructed Lincoln and his dog search team to start from the bottom floors and work up, while Olivia took her dog search team and started at the top floor and went down, the team she completely split up from at the 23rd floor (totally unbelievable) and then she and her team searched alternate floors or something on the way down because she thought the search wasn’t going fast enough.

      I don’t know if 23 is significant, or shown just to help follow along the floor search thing. Maybe its another of JJ’s numbers? Like 47?

      If I’ve gotten anything wrong, other posters please correct me, thanks.

      Like: Thumb up 0

      • Mel Duff says

        I agree with your analysis of the events. But…A. As you pointed out, she wouldn’t have separated from her team. B. How did Lincoln’s team search 22 other floors when she only hit two? How long was she in the Money Pit?

        Like: Thumb up 0

        • g33k says

          Wasn’t there a point where they were trying to call Olivia on the radio and she couldn’t answer as she was stuck in the hole? maybe that’s when the Lincoln team left their search and went upstairs.

          Have to watch again to be sure, but that may be it.

          Like: Thumb up 1

      • Dylan says

        That annoyed me that. She issues everyone to split up, so three of them head in one direction and she just goes on her own.

        smart Olivia…real smart…

        Like: Thumb up 2

        • JM says

          I personally hate it when characters are demeaned for story purposes and this has been particuarly evident in seasons 3 and 4, noticeably peter in season 3 (no way he wouldnt have noticed olivia wasnt olivia) and now in season 4 olivia dosent seem to know how to investigate crime scenes and for some reason the newbie on the team (eyebrow man) is much better than her at it i believe this was most evident in episode 3, and just because they wanted a scene with olivia and the MOTW alone together they have to get her to do something thats completely out of character.

          Like: Thumb up 5

          • djy2500 says

            the reason olivia seems off her game is because she is not “our” Olivia. In this reality she is seems more mechanical. Where as our olivia lets her emotions drive her.

            Like: Thumb up 2

            • JM says

              But i thought this olivia was supposed to be more “emotionally capable” than “our” olivia? i thought that was stated in interviews?

              Like: Thumb up 1

              • number six says

                They have said that in interviews, but I don’t know, her emotional capability hasn’t been consistently portrayed. The premiere showed a very closed off Olivia with a “hole in her life” but in the following episodes, she has been amazingly chipper, friendly and warm. Then she went back to cold again, granted, that was with Peter. In this episode she was all warm, friendly and deeply infatuated with Lincoln, but then she told Nina her emotions were muted. WHAT?

                Like: Thumb up 4

  50. Kung says

    I still like the show and all, but I can’t believe that the writers/producers are wasting so much time on boring cases while there would be so much more interesting stuff to tell the viewers!
    The viewers and fans of Fringe want
    Answers!!!
    Observers!
    Hilarious and brilliant “Walter-action”!
    Actions to find a way to heal both dying worlds!
    Peter finding a way to be able to GO HOME to his and our original timeline – we miss the characters we know and love!

    Stop waisting time by turning this into another “boldandthebeautifulsoap”!

    Hope things get better in January :(

    Like: Thumb up 6

  51. Dylan says

    Why not do another poll for the season’s break?

    All those who are in the positive crowd this season, ‘like’ this post.

    Well-loved. Like: Thumb up 33

        • number six says

          I thought that episodes 5 and 6 were heading in the right direction, but everything was undone in this episode. I found it extremely aggravating. It’s like they don’t even care anymore, not about the S1-S3 characters anyway. Just see how sidelined Peter, as soon as they gave him the obligatory “episode per season”. Any repercussions about his presence with Olivia Sue or with Walter? Nope. Any curiosity about The Fringe Event? Nope. Everyone carrying on with their lives as if a man didn’t pop into existance a few days ago? Yep. Repeat with me: Continuity is for sissies.

          Like: Thumb up 7

          • JM says

            grr, look it would be a bit of a piss take if they only gave him one episode if its “peters season” but hey listen! look at the new promo and what character is in it like all the way through!?

            Like: Thumb up 1

            • number six says

              It looks like an ensemble episode, which is something I like. Don’t get me wrong, it might be more Peter-centric than not, but I can’t know, until I watch it. Anyway, Dylan is asking about the aired episodes and those are the only ones I can talk about.

              Like: Thumb up 2

              • JM says

                ok i misunderstood and apologise :(, i do agree with you that episode 5 and 6 were heading in the right direction, i thought episode 6 was actually season 3 quality (feel free to disagree) it was a huge mistake by the writers to sideline peter in episode 7 though, huge..

                Like: Thumb up 4

            • Dylan says

              but I could also argue that you look at the promos for season 4. Who featured in the promos the most? Yet who features in the episodes the least?

              Promos can be deceptive. They can consist of several episodes instead of one. I wouldn’t be surprised if we didn’t see half of those things contained within the promo, in the next episode.

              Like: Thumb up 2

              • number six says

                “The Season of Peter” *snort* has been promoted like it really is the season of Peter. He is the one who has been featured the most in the promos, when he was actually in the episode and when he wasn’t, the importance has been implied with dramatic lines about him like that was important for the writers. But what have they given us instead? The season of “Look How Adorable Lincoln Is”. Blech!

                Compare that with the season of Olivia. They promised and they delivered.

                The only payoff I can hope for now is that they make the new main protagonist a shapeshifter, because sure as heck they are failing Peter miserably, as always.

                Like: Thumb up 5

          • Mel Duff says

            “Continuity if for sissies…”

            I gave this a lot of thought. I want to assume these issues, such as the one I mentioned about Olivia splitting up to search the building, are part of an over-reaching story arc about time jumps, but I hadn’t considered them to be continuity errors, as well as abnormal behaviors from the characters. Thanks very much, number six, for pointing this out. Well-reasoned.

            Like: Thumb up 2

  52. Mike Mike says

    There is nothing wrong with fans that have dedicated three years to this show to complain about what they consider a slow or bad start to the season.

    Hot debate. What do you think? Thumb up 9

  53. djy2500 says

    It was a “filler” episode, the every show has them. yes, it sucks we got robbed out of the fall finale we wanted and deserved, but thats the way the multiverse works.

    Like: Thumb up 2

  54. Ian Smyth says

    Reading all these comments here, about how people are feeling betrayed and not understanding what the writers are doing, and why should we invest in this new timeline, makes me question the show itself a bit as well.

    But then I remember that this is Fringe. No, there are no new writers this season. There are no new people on this show. The people behind this show are the same people and nothing has changed for them between the stopped writing season 3 and started writing season 4. They are still the creative geniuses, and they are going in a direction that will ultimately leave us feeling incredibly satisfied.

    In fact, these first 7 episodes have been very good in my opinion. In each episode we were given a piece of information that will be necessary in the coming episodes. We learnt that September chose not to erase Peter, that there are scientists studying the machine, that there are human shapeshifters, that Walter and Olivia were able to think of Peter even before he appeared, that time loops and time bubbles are possible, and finally that Peter has a friend now…Lincoln.

    These 6 important points are key necessities for what’s to come. And what’s to come is very big. See, the first 7 episodes were like doing the outside of a puzzle first. It’s boring, simple, easy, and no brain power is really needed. However, it sets the framework for the big picture that’s about to be made.

    Everything that happened in these 7 episodes, every case, every interaction, every scene was for a reason and that is to get us to the perfect point where all the character’s motivations of what’s going to happen next will make sense. It will make sense that Lincoln will help Peter cross over to the other side, it will make sense that we must stop the human shapeshifters, it makes sense why time bubbles were introduced.

    Everything will make sense, and the promo for “Back to Where You’ve Never Been” certainly shows that. I think we have our framework done now, and the rest of the season will be about putting together a very large, but incredible puzzle. There is even a reason we’ve had to invest in this timeline and I wouldn’t be surprised if there will be some sort of merge between the two timelines, giving our old characters new information about the universe they live in.

    Trust the writers and trust this show. It’s still the same show it was when Peter exited the BBM months ago, we just need a little patience and it will dearly pay off.

    Well-loved. Like: Thumb up 12

      • Dylan says

        I concur with that statement. I think what is happening is that, now the season is in break, audience members are venting their current frustrations with the series – triggered by a sup-par episode.

        Like: Thumb up 1

        • JM says

          Yes its probably the worst episode they could have left us on, no doubt episode 8 was to trigger and get us excited for the rest of the season, this episode has just left a bad taste in the mouth of some fans (me included)

          Like: Thumb up 2

    • g33k says

      I feel like all 7 episodes have all been about showing us effects before cause, just like the time loops in the show. I bet the end (and the cause) is near though! :-)

      Like: Thumb up 4

    • lafra08 says

      These are exactly my thoughts! At first I was also a little bit disappointed I didn’t like this Newtimeline storyline and missed Our original characters(I actually still do miss them very much!) But than I understood the writers want us to get invested in this Newtimeline we are going to stay there for longer-It was a huge risk- a lot of fans don’t like this idea at all and once again a loveletter to the Original timeline it took us 3 years to get invested in the OT and Original characters so I think this is impossible now to really start to care about the New within 7 Eps but I love the show and trust the writers and I love how they make me think about things such like time paradox, time loops, time bubbels,love and loss and simply how would I feel and what I would do if I find myself in another timeline where noone remembers me, where I ‘m a stranger alone in the world it’s genius how they make us think over and over again! I think the writers know we love the OT so we are going to have an amazing payoff I guess we didn’t see the last of them in season 3 I think in the end the 2 timelines merge somehow introducing new possibilities for our beloved characters! So trust the writers !enjoy the ride! this show is Brilliant!

      Like: Thumb up 5

  55. zakray says

    Liked the episode, I’ve been lurking and reading the comments every episode but have yet to really comment.
    I don’t know if anybody has thought of this yet, but is it possible that Peter hasn’t yet actually come out of the BBM. We know that they have been through the events once already, what if this wasn’t Peter’s first time in the machine that this is just another round of consequence Peter is seeing/living to help him make his final decision. Of course my theories have been total wrong before (i.e. Lost, BSG)
    Otherwise I love having Josh back I missed him I seemed to have the same emptiness that Olivia was feeling when he was gone.

    Like: Thumb up 2

  56. Sanj says

    Humph, so I see that the Fringe community has been infected with the Doctor Who fan disease: if you dare dislike an episode you are a “whiner” and have no rights to an opinion….we must all swallow whatever they give us and smile, no matter how rotten the episode. Whatever.

    I didn’t think this was a rotten episode, but it was rather boring and derivative. As the wife pointed out it didn’t do anything we haven’t seen a dozen times in this show already…experimented-on kid, Massive Dynamic, the experimented-upon-kid being a broken adult, etc. Many similarities to what we’ve seen before and very little moved forward until the end with Nina’s duplicity (are Olivia’s recurring headaches a result of her being drugged by Nina on a regular basis?) I have to say I’m getting sick of the rebooted universe, especially Walter. Which is sad because Peter and Walter had come so far at the end of the last season.

    I don’t buy into this whole “season finale” garbage Fox is trying to sell us to begin with, but this is a really weak episode to have the show go out on for two whole meaningless months. In my house the kids have stopped watching completely and my wife is about to give up on the show, leaving just me as a regular viewer. I don’t need a Neilson box to tell me what the score is: and it’s all because of the continuing, ongoing pre-emptions that this show suffers no matter WHAT timeslot it is shoved into.

    I don’t fault the writers…every season has Molebabies and Brown Betties. I do blame Fox. Their teasers always promise lots, but they shred those promises by continuing to disrupt this show’s continuity. A two month break? Are you kidding me? This season has barely gotten STARTED. How many other of Fox’s shows are now on “hiatus”? I bet Glee isn’t. As such, I find it really hard to get “excited” about the new teaser crumbs fox is throwing at us. So we get Fringe back in January. How long before Fox shelves it again after that? We may be from safe from American Idiot but we’ve already seen that Fox finds any reason it can to take Fringe off the air. Heck they don’t even give reasons now (like the re-run friday before the baseball pre-emption).

    Maybe we should petition to get Fringe moved to Netflix. If Netflix can resurrect “Arrested Development,” maybe they can be Fringe’s best friend too.

    In the end, “Wallflower” is just a sad metaphor for the health of this show…trying desperately to be seen, continually vanishing from the airwaves before our eyes. I just hope the show doesn’t end up like the antagonist of this episode.

    Like: Thumb up 6

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